Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby CrustyMTB on Tue 1/Dec/09 7:59pm

All this horseshit about "catching up with the Aussies" "Why kiwis are shit at business" has got me thinking.
So I did some research.
According to the CIA fact book

State Domestic product per capita in Aus 07-08 was
WA US$56G
NT US$55G
QLD US$55G
NSW US$38G
VIC US$36G
TAS US$35G
SA US$34G

NZ GDP was US$31G

I forgot ACT sooooooo easy to do, anyhey

So if we ignore the big mining 3, the others average at $35,7500.

While I'm not saying NZ doesn't need to lift it's game, we certainly don't need to hock the family silver, the third childs secondary school education and grans false teeth to do it.

I reckon raise retirement age to 70, means test super, return ACC to its core principles, give tax breaks for R&D, lose student loans, but raise entry requirements, legalise pot (big tax take right there) lift the tax bands, and a capital gains tax for second, third etc properties.

Your thoughts callers?
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby Kyle on Tue 1/Dec/09 8:20pm

Add in raise GST to 15% and no income tax on first $10k + some small shuffling of tax brackets and it would be perfect.
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby znomit on Tue 1/Dec/09 8:28pm

In 2025 wont we be filthy rich, selling Supertankers full of water and everything we can grow to whoever is still living in the salty dustbowl called Australia?
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby jo on Tue 1/Dec/09 8:48pm

Who'd want to live in aussie anyway. :huh:
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby wuffy on Tue 1/Dec/09 8:58pm

jo wrote:Who'd want to live in aussie anyway. :huh:


Kangaroos and Koala bears. Did you know Koala bears have finger tips and prints identical to humans?

You could set up 20 koalas with oil to rub your back.... just close your eyes and imagine it's 20 beautiful women.... except with fur.
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby happybaboon on Tue 1/Dec/09 9:04pm

CrustyMTB wrote:Your thoughts callers?

The best way to fix NZ's alleged/imaginary problems is to throw a boatload of cash at Don Brash and his nutcase rightwing buddies in exchange for them regurgitating mindless ACT party policy. Oh, wait, we already did that.

It's retarded to compare NZ's economy to Australias. They dig all their wealth out of the ground, and that can't last forever. Eventually they'll become a gigantic Nauru. NZ's advantage is that our agriculture and horticulture could continue to thrive indefinitely (as long as we stop the minority of farmers from totally fucking up the environment). If we can become a sustainable producer of high quality meats and crops and milk then we'd be totally sweet. Oh, and tourism as well. People will want to come to lovely clean green NZ more than strip-mined-to-fuck Australia (but that'll only work if we actually become clean and green).
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby Nick_K on Tue 1/Dec/09 9:09pm

CrustyMTB wrote:I reckon raise retirement age to 70, means test super, return ACC to its core principles, give tax breaks for R&D, lose student loans, but raise entry requirements, legalise pot (big tax take right there) lift the tax bands, and a capital gains tax for second, third etc properties.

Your thoughts callers?


You filthy capitalist.

Raising the retirement age to 70 would go down like a sack of shit.
Tax breaks for R&D would turn out to be another rort for big business.
Lift tax bands primarily help the rich and does little for productivity.
Lose student loans? Do you mean make tertiary education free or lose the interest free component? Either way I disagree.

Completely agree on the capital gains tax on second etc properties though. It needs to go further than this though and also include capital gains on shares and other investments to widen the taxable base and level the playing field for wage earners those who live off investments.

I'd also like to see the government buy back into essential industries.
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby happybaboon on Tue 1/Dec/09 9:18pm

CrustyMTB wrote:I reckon raise retirement age to 70, means test super, return ACC to its core principles, give tax breaks for R&D, lose student loans, but raise entry requirements, legalise pot (big tax take right there) lift the tax bands, and a capital gains tax for second, third etc properties.

I say phase in some sort of partial-retirement thing, where people at 65 and above can choose to keep working a bit AND get a bit of superannuation paid.
Means testing never works, ever.
ACC needs to be left the fuck alone and dialed back to a no-fault, everyone pays about the same, complete coverage for accidents type thing,
Tax breaks for R&D is dodgy, better to leave the tax the same and then just invest directly in companies/universities doing promising research.
Interest free student loans is an OK system, but I'd be down with making entrance requirements higher, culling some of the stupid courses that people can do, and lowering fees.
Legalised pot could be a great money earner... The Govt. could grow it themselves and sell it only in pharmacies with a big 'ole (like, 50%?) tax on it. And think of all the jobs that would create for released prisoners, a number of whom have extensive experience in growing weed. And it'd help limit the crime associated with weed, and free up a tonne of police time. I bet they could sell it in pharmacies with a big tax on it and it'd still be cheaper than what the criminals currently get for the stuff.
Tax the fuck out of property investors and realestate types. Scumbags be fucking wit our country bigtime.
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby nostromo on Tue 1/Dec/09 9:21pm

Go gangbusters in the South Seas and dig up all the Oil. Thats a winner (if there really is some there). Oil is currently our third biggest export at 2.8 Billion a year.
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby happybaboon on Tue 1/Dec/09 9:25pm

The oil thing seems like it's just a big load of speculation from people who want to go and look, on the off chance that there actually is some oil down there. It'd be nice if there was oil, but don't hold your breath.
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby SlackBoy on Tue 1/Dec/09 9:37pm

happybaboon wrote:
CrustyMTB wrote:I reckon raise retirement age to 70, means test super, return ACC to its core principles, give tax breaks for R&D, lose student loans, but raise entry requirements, legalise pot (big tax take right there) lift the tax bands, and a capital gains tax for second, third etc properties.

I say phase in some sort of partial-retirement thing, where people at 65 and above can choose to keep working a bit AND get a bit of superannuation paid.
Means testing never works, ever.
ACC needs to be left the fuck alone and dialed back to a no-fault, everyone pays about the same, complete coverage for accidents type thing,
Tax breaks for R&D is dodgy, better to leave the tax the same and then just invest directly in companies/universities doing promising research.
Interest free student loans is an OK system, but I'd be down with making entrance requirements higher, culling some of the stupid courses that people can do, and lowering fees.
Legalised pot could be a great money earner... The Govt. could grow it themselves and sell it only in pharmacies with a big 'ole (like, 50%?) tax on it. And think of all the jobs that would create for released prisoners, a number of whom have extensive experience in growing weed. And it'd help limit the crime associated with weed, and free up a tonne of police time. I bet they could sell it in pharmacies with a big tax on it and it'd still be cheaper than what the criminals currently get for the stuff.
Tax the fuck out of property investors and realestate types. Scumbags be fucking wit our country bigtime.
It's the 3rd sign of the appocolypse, I agree with babs
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby hickie on Tue 1/Dec/09 9:52pm

here's an idea for you to ponder, raise the super age to 70 but lower the age you can draw Kiwi saver to 60 so those that are good and squirrel away lots can retire early if they wish...

After all the average life expectancy is now 80, so that's still 10 years they will draw a pension on average.
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby Oli on Tue 1/Dec/09 10:01pm

SlackBoy wrote:It's the 3rd sign of the appocolypse, I agree with babs
It's spelled "ACROPOLIS", you ninny.
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby Kevin Hague on Tue 1/Dec/09 10:05pm

I reckon it's important to point out that none of the things Brash and his mates have come up with seemed to play any role in how Australia got to be where Australia is, and also whether we are sure we want to be where they are (?) I mean, I have no interest at all in living in Australia, but do some of the things Brash suggests, and I might well. The point made by HB and others is quite right: Australia may well offer economic rewards but that's hardly the be all and end all. We have a whole lot of quality of life stuff that they don't.

An even bigger question is "what is the economy for, anyway?" I know it seems like the economy is some kind of force of nature, but really it's something humans have made to achieve particular objectives (chiefly the enrichment of the few). We can change it to achieve different objectives if we want. For example, if you ask people what's really important to them, the three things that they most often come up with are happiness, good health and a positive future for their kids. Well our economy is a poor match for these objectives. In fact while the economy has grown more or less steadily since the second world war, happiness has not (and in fact seems to be declining). What do you know, more big screen tvs didn't make us any happier, they made us fatter and they compomised our kids' futures by increasing the debt they will have to manage. Inequality is the other big side effect of our economy, and is associated with just about every negative indicator you can think of (for example countries with more unequal wealth have lower overall life expectancies, educational achievement etc). So instead of catching up with Oz, how about a national conversation about what would be a way to organise the economy to be fairer and make people happier?

Actually some of the ideas in this thread are already a good start, I think.
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Re: Lies Damn Lies And Australian Gdp

Postby j2hyde on Tue 1/Dec/09 10:43pm

Abolish the RMA and regional councils. 3 levels of gubbiment for a bit over 3 million people in a tiny country is a pisstake, and the resulting churn is unproductive.

And to answer the question about "Why catch up with Oz?":
1. Wealth and poverty are relative
2. Being poor is shit

Anyone who doesn't understand those very simple points needs to go spend some quality time in the developing world.
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