Postby Jono on Sun 13/Jan/02 12:18am

Righto mr gimpy - an easy question this time. If I'm gonna put discs on the bike, I need to change the shifters (cos they're integrated with the brakes at the moment) - I can still get 8 speed XTR shifter pods, or for 10 pounds more, 9 speed ones.

Should I get the 9 speed ones? Does 9 speed clusters fill up with mud? Do your chains break more often? Will I be broken carrying around all that extra weight?  :eh:
Jono
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Postby gimp on Mon 14/Jan/02 12:26pm

I was disappointed to discover that 9 speed isn't a bunch of arse.

When 9 speed was first announced people like myself threw our hands in the air and predicted the end of the world along with.
* Chains that break 'cos they're too narrow
* Chain suck 'cos the narrow chains would clog with mud
* Chains and cogs that wear out really quick 'cos they're narrower
* Shifting problems with 9 cogs on the back
* Cogs that would bend 'cos they're too narrow
* Drivetrains that would choke with mud 'cos they're too narrow

Unfortunately none of this happened and we had to eat crow, and finally pretend we didn't 'dis 9 speed to start off with.

In summary 9 speed is fine, it works well and offers you a hell range in the middle chainring, meaning less pesky front cogset shifts.

The only thing gotcha I can really add is - buy a good chain and check it regularly for stretch - replace when it starts to go. A Dura-ace/XTR, high-end Sachs or Rolloff are all good choices - don't bother with cheap chains - they suck arse.

Hmm... Really need a gimp Emoticon...  :satan:
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Postby Jono on Tue 15/Jan/02 4:08am

gimp wrote:The only thing gotcha I can really add is - buy a good chain and check it regularly for stretch - replace when it starts to go. A Dura-ace/XTR, high-end Sachs or Rolloff are all good choices - don't bother with cheap chains - they suck arse.

Jono realises that he left his chain stretch measuring device back in NZ. Oh well, back to the tried and trued "those gears are looking worn, better change them <and then the chain slips all the time> method... :angry:
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Postby gimp on Tue 15/Jan/02 12:33pm

No no no... Bad Jono... You don't wait until your cogs have worn out - that is expensive and wrong :angry:

If you don't have a chain stretch measuring thing there are two good options.

1) Go to a shop with a chain stretch thingy and borrow it.
2) Shift to the big ring on the front - if the chain is entering far left on the top teeth and exiting far left on the bottom teeth then it's stretched.

If your chain is stretched don't arse around - replace it immediately.
gimp
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Postby Mr Strange on Sat 19/Jan/02 11:23am

I would like to lash the rantings of the gimp......

9 speed is crap, I wouldn't touch with a 10 ft pole. Stick with 8sp, as all of the things that the gimp said doesn't happen actually do.

Mainly that 9sp wears faster - it wears around 30% faster, as would be expected, it has a smaller contact area.

The gimp has just had good luck with his one, and doesn't know how lucky he is..... And he has a sexy mask!

Here's something to fry your minds - chains don't stretch! - the increased length is caused by wear.

I have 8sp on all 5 of my bikes that I never ride. And on 3 of them I took the new 9sp off and sold it to buy 8 speed.

Anyone want to buy a brand new set of LX 9sp shifter pods, $80 for the pair?

:alien:
Mr Strange
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Postby Jono on Mon 21/Jan/02 1:18am

Righto then. Given that mr strange says 8speed is the way to go, and mr gimp has currently had his brain replaced by shimano, the good advice I've got coming out of this one is:

a) I should probably check my chain for stretch

b) saving money on the 8 speed pods might be good (it's about $30 difference, from memory), and it would definitely save me money, but we're not sure how long xtr 8speed clusters will be available

c) mr strange has better headgear than mr gimp  :D
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Postby seamonkey on Wed 23/Jan/02 5:25am

Sorry I just can't keep myself from this one. Mr Gimp, aptly named, needs his zip zipped, he speaketh absolute bullshit. As for Jono who I ride with most weekends and spend cursing my piece of shit gears which I just cannot get to work, you should knw better. Hell if it were up to me I'd still be on 7spd, after all, all you ever need is Granny, a Couple of Middle gears and one decent high gear.
Sorry I rant, I do feel stongly about this one. :angry:
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Postby gimp on Wed 23/Jan/02 12:27pm

Excellent - dissent in the ranks... A couple of things should be noticed about my experiences with 9 speed.
* I've been running it for 3 years
* I ride into large bogs on regular occassions
* "Bicycle Maintenance" is a very nice idea but I honestly can't be bothered
* I haven't noticed 9 speed wearing out measurably faster than 8 speed.

Logically it should wear out faster - and that's what wrench-monkeys like myself and Mr Strange predicted... But it my case it just hasn't happened. :laugh: WA HA HA... I win!

I'm gathering that seamonkey is running 9 speed now - and it's sucking - what are other people's experiences?

Oh yeah...
Mr Strange sez: Here's something to fry your minds - chains don't stretch! - the increased length is caused by wear.


Chains do so stretch, and the increased length is caused by wear. If you take an old chain off the bike it is noticeable longer than a new chain - the best term for this is "chain stretch" - If there's a better term out there I've yet to hear it (chain lengthing? chain longermation?)

Here's something to think about - gear/brake cables don't stretch - "cable stretch" is a term that bike mechanics have come up with to get out of tuning your bike properly before you buy it. "Cable Stretch" is caused by the end caps of the cable outers seating into the braze ons on the frame, and onto the outer itself...

But the steel cable itself does not stretch...
(Unlike the chain, which is longer, so therefore has stretched)
gimp
Member for: 15 years 11 months

Postby Jono on Thu 24/Jan/02 6:53am

gimp wrote:Here's something to think about - gear/brake cables don't stretch - "cable stretch" is a term that bike mechanics have come up with to get out of tuning your bike properly before you buy it. "Cable Stretch" is caused by the end caps of the cable outers seating into the braze ons on the frame, and onto the outer itself...

But the steel cable itself does not stretch...


Well, the cable may not stretch, but a strange phenomenon with space compression within the cable outers means that over time, the cable becomes too long (thus it is stretched, because it doesn't shrink like the rest of the universe?  :withstupid:
Jono
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Postby SlackBoy on Mon 28/Jan/02 2:12pm

I agree with sea monkey
Ever notice that how when ever you go into mud your shit fills up faster than it used back in the day of 7 speed.
22 32 is a stupid gear, it's a pansy gear and made for woofters by woofters. 28 28 is the lowest you should need, all hill can be climbed in this. Haven't you all wondered why everyone isn't half as hard as the old skool riders once where. All these ultra low gears are making you soft, you nancys!!!!
Hell back in the dy we used to sail up the climbs on karapoti with 28 28 and toeclips, now half the people can't make it up with 22 32 and spd's, it's soft i say soft!!!

Bring back 7 speed rear clusters, thumb shifters that work for ever and in 50 foot of mud

:baaa:
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Postby Hoz on Mon 4/Feb/02 3:40pm

yeah man, for sure

My first bike had 18 speed xt on it......6 rear sprockets with huge mud clearing gaps

just as well cos riverhead clay in the winter was like the devil's crap :satan:

pity about the under the chainstay U-brake which locked everything up even though the drive-train was still shifting sweet as

:angry:  :crazy:
Hoz
Member for: 15 years 11 months

Postby pissface on Thu 2/Dec/04 2:35pm

SlackBoy wrote:22 32 is a stupid gear, it's a pansy gear and made for woofters by woofters. 28 28 is the lowest you should need, all hill can be climbed in this. Haven't you all wondered why everyone isn't half as hard as the old skool riders once where. All these ultra low gears are making you soft, you nancys!!!!
:0 yarrr !
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Postby Henry Dorset Case on Thu 2/Dec/04 5:14pm

so if 22 32 is a pansy gear, whats 22 34??
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Postby Robbie on Thu 2/Dec/04 5:22pm

Better!!
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Postby Dan_hurley on Thu 2/Dec/04 5:23pm

Jono wrote:
gimp wrote:Here's something to think about - gear/brake cables don't stretch - "cable stretch" is a term that bike mechanics have come up with to get out of tuning your bike properly before you buy it. "Cable Stretch" is caused by the end caps of the cable outers seating into the braze ons on the frame, and onto the outer itself...

But the steel cable itself does not stretch...


Well, the cable may not stretch, but a strange phenomenon with space compression within the cable outers means that over time, the cable becomes too long (thus it is stretched, because it doesn't shrink like the rest of the universe?  :withstupid:


W3rd
Dan_hurley
Member for: 13 years 2 months

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