Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby Tama on Sun 20/Sep/09 9:17pm

Colin wrote:
Tama wrote:Personally I reckon mountain bikes on Whakapapa/ Turoa over summer would be a winner - but only if lessons were learnt from down south.

My guess is that wont happen :(

National Park and all.

When some shots for Lord of the Rings were shot at Whakapapa, every piece of 2nd hand carpet in the lower North Island where bought to spread out so the crew wouldn't damage the plants.

What gets me about that is the HUGE impact that the skifields have. It's quite amazing to walk up there in summer as the footprint of operations is pretty freaking large, and that's not even counting the rusting cables and debris scattered around.

You'd think a track network would be the least of their worries as far as environmental impact goes but I guess this more about historic use than the actual environment.
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby radiusq on Sun 20/Sep/09 9:37pm

Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head Tama. We have to face the fact that there's just not enough mountain bikers who will turn up and pay out to ride lift access trails. I think the main issue is that it's too easy for us to get some altitude via other means. Unlike skiers and snowboarders, we can pedal up the hill too. We can also put the bike on the back of a car and shuttle. We don't have to wait until the lifts open, and that's why we all haven't ridden Coronet Peak. If the only possible way to experience mountain biking was via skifields for 3months of the year then you can bet the skifields would be packed with bikes.
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby Trail on Sun 20/Sep/09 10:07pm

JohnnyC wrote:
Trail wrote:I think another key factor is the terrain that is involved. Many ski fields are:

1. Above the tree line. This means there is no shelter if the mountain weather is nasty combined with altitude and NZ weather, that will kill a large part of the season. What this also means is that the trails are able to be seen on the hill side from a long way off... which is something else that DOC are not keen on (visual impact and all that).

2. On or near the top of a mountainside of rocks. In summer time many of the ski fields are covered in scree and piles of chunky loose rock. This definitely does not make it easy for people to be able to build trails!!

I think for lift accessed riding to work well (be profitable) in NZ it would need to be:
1. Near a major population center.
2. Be low enough altitude that the trails could be built through trees (less erosion and less impact from weather, shelter for riders, and trees are more fun to ride through!)
3. Have a large network of trails from complete novice through to National DH level.


:withstupid:

NO skifield in New Zealand has good terrain for building trails, Coronet was ok but still far from Ideal. Overseas skifields are bigger and have more useable terrain with several lifts, most NZ fields would have 1 lift and about 3 trails.


Which is why I believe that for a chair operated bike park to operate successfully in NZ, it would have to be a specific bike park chair lift, put in on a suitable hill side, near to a major center.

Anyone got a decent chunk of land and a few million to buy a chair lift??
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby Henry Dorset Case on Sun 20/Sep/09 10:21pm

Trail wrote:
Anyone got a decent chunk of land and a few million to buy a chair lift??


I can do you better than a chairlift: In chur chur there is a very large very expensive, subsidised with ratepayers and taxpayers money FREAKIN GONDOLA. Its a huuuuge loss making white elephant. what it needs is some bike hooks on that bad boy. sensible pricing, and bobs your uncle. Its 15 minutes from a large-ish urban population that is no doubt bored with nutjob murders and topping hookers and looking for a new challenge, it has options for easy tracks (traverse, some of vic park, or hard and fast (bridle path hrd bits of vic park etc). You dont have the tyranny of distance argument, the above th tree line problem, the weather might crap itself issue (if it does you are five minutes from the car). And who has ever used the bloody thing? I'm a prime example of the target market, and Ive never been there: hugely expensive to have a go, and the restaurant at the top is by all reports heinously expensive and very very average.

One other issue that crossed my mind reading Tama's thoughts: Do they still do the heli-bike thing out of Wanaka and Qtown? That was very successful and popular, and it would be a shedload more expensive than buying a lift pass.

I do hear what you say about the people who say "Shit yearh, I'm up for that" then don't go: I am one of them, though that argument doesnt apply to the brake burner: I think I am right in saying it sold out every year bar the first? I actually am doing some mtb-ing of late and (really) would have considered doing it this year (well next but you know what I mean)
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby j2hyde on Sun 20/Sep/09 10:41pm

Tama wrote:
Colin wrote:
Tama wrote:Personally I reckon mountain bikes on Whakapapa/ Turoa over summer would be a winner - but only if lessons were learnt from down south.

My guess is that wont happen :(

National Park and all.

When some shots for Lord of the Rings were shot at Whakapapa, every piece of 2nd hand carpet in the lower North Island where bought to spread out so the crew wouldn't damage the plants.

What gets me about that is the HUGE impact that the skifields have. It's quite amazing to walk up there in summer as the footprint of operations is pretty freaking large, and that's not even counting the rusting cables and debris scattered around.

You'd think a track network would be the least of their worries as far as environmental impact goes but I guess this more about historic use than the actual environment.


Having concerns about "the environment" when the topic of discussion is a couple of tracks built on a ski resort built on an active volcano or rapidly eroding pile of scree on a rather unstable continental plate boundary is just a pisstake. Some people take their own guilt and tokenism far too seriously.
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby DropKick on Sun 20/Sep/09 11:19pm

j2hyde wrote:
Tama wrote:
Colin wrote:
Tama wrote:Personally I reckon mountain bikes on Whakapapa/ Turoa over summer would be a winner - but only if lessons were learnt from down south.

My guess is that wont happen :(

National Park and all.

When some shots for Lord of the Rings were shot at Whakapapa, every piece of 2nd hand carpet in the lower North Island where bought to spread out so the crew wouldn't damage the plants.

What gets me about that is the HUGE impact that the skifields have. It's quite amazing to walk up there in summer as the footprint of operations is pretty freaking large, and that's not even counting the rusting cables and debris scattered around.

You'd think a track network would be the least of their worries as far as environmental impact goes but I guess this more about historic use than the actual environment.


Having concerns about "the environment" when the topic of discussion is a couple of tracks built on a ski resort built on an active volcano or rapidly eroding pile of scree on a rather unstable continental plate boundary is just a pisstake. Some people take their own guilt and tokenism far too seriously.

Are you saying Chris Kahui didnt kill his babies cos of the effect modern man is having on the planet? :eh:
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby j2hyde on Sun 20/Sep/09 11:25pm

Umm, yeah, sure. :eh:
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby Fraser on Mon 21/Sep/09 8:20am

The gondolas were never going to work. This complex ecosystem of skanky MotoX and DH gear spread inside a jap import was always difficult to replecate.
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby bugle on Mon 21/Sep/09 8:47am

Indeed, I demand my gondola chair has an FM radio that wont pick up any NZ stations and beeping noises when the door is open.
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby Henry Dorset Case on Mon 21/Sep/09 9:26am

j2hyde wrote:Having concerns about "the environment" when the topic of discussion is a couple of tracks built on a ski resort built on an active volcano or rapidly eroding pile of scree on a rather unstable continental plate boundary is just a pisstake. Some people take their own guilt and tokenism far too seriously.


was that the answer if the question was "In todays episode of "Ask a Geologist" we're talking about what you can do to prevent plate tectonics and fractal flows ruining your life: What can YOU do?"
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby OAP on Mon 21/Sep/09 9:45am

was that the answer if the question was "In todays episode of "Ask a Geologist" we're talking about what you can do to prevent plate tectonics and fractal flows ruining your life: What can YOU do?"[/quote]

Get a perm

But no seriously, getting back to the club areas that were being mentioned, as some know there is already a network of XC trails being developed and soon you may see some DH/freeride trails around the Castle Hill, Broken River forest area but not many seem to know about it and not many seem to want to make the hour and a half drive there from ChCh to use it. Its a beaut piece of real estate but there is nothing there save a few holiday homes in the Castle Hill Village and a couple of club lodges, no bars, no restaurants no cafes.
Last edited by OAP on Mon 21/Sep/09 9:53am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby Trail on Mon 21/Sep/09 9:51am

OAP wrote:was that the answer if the question was "In todays episode of "Ask a Geologist" we're talking about what you can do to prevent plate tectonics and fractal flows ruining your life: What can YOU do?"


Get a perm[/quote]

learn how to quote
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby Henry Dorset Case on Mon 21/Sep/09 10:41am

OAP wrote:was that the answer if the question was "In todays episode of "Ask a Geologist" we're talking about what you can do to prevent plate tectonics and fractal flows ruining your life: What can YOU do?"


Get a perm

But no seriously, getting back to the club areas that were being mentioned, as some know there is already a network of XC trails being developed and soon you may see some DH/freeride trails around the Castle Hill, Broken River forest area but not many seem to know about it and not many seem to want to make the hour and a half drive there from ChCh to use it. Its a beaut piece of real estate but there is nothing there save a few holiday homes in the Castle Hill Village and a couple of club lodges, no bars, no restaurants no cafes.[/quote]

apart from the excellent pub at the Bealey, the shops and such at Springfield (hellooooo springfield pie shop) and poxy old Arthurs Arse all within about ten minutes you mean?

and in summer the craigieburn ride is one of the best rides in canterbury.
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby Oli on Mon 21/Sep/09 10:54am

Henry Dorset Case wrote:
OAP wrote:
Henry Dorset Case wrote:was that the answer if the question was "In todays episode of "Ask a Geologist" we're talking about what you can do to prevent plate tectonics and fractal flows ruining your life: What can YOU do?"


Get a perm

But no seriously, getting back to the club areas that were being mentioned, as some know there is already a network of XC trails being developed and soon you may see some DH/freeride trails around the Castle Hill, Broken River forest area but not many seem to know about it and not many seem to want to make the hour and a half drive there from ChCh to use it. Its a beaut piece of real estate but there is nothing there save a few holiday homes in the Castle Hill Village and a couple of club lodges, no bars, no restaurants no cafes.


apart from the excellent pub at the Bealey, the shops and such at Springfield (hellooooo springfield pie shop) and poxy old Arthurs Arse all within about ten minutes you mean?

and in summer the craigieburn ride is one of the best rides in canterbury.
Sorted out your quoting for you. Thanks may be proffered in gold. :)
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Re: Mountain Bikes On Nz Ski Fields - What Went Wrong

Postby danose on Mon 21/Sep/09 11:56am

OAP wrote:But no seriously, getting back to the club areas that were being mentioned, as some know there is already a network of XC trails being developed and soon you may see some DH/freeride trails around the Castle Hill, Broken River forest area


'being developed'? Sure there's edge/luge/dracophyllum, and the wee network of trails in the block of bush behind the village - but the planned link from that block thru and over to the old skating rink never seemed to get anywhere - has that plan actually been resurrected (was a good idea - I'd much rather ride singletrack to/from the village than face trudging up the road)
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