Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby inzane on Sun 1/Feb/09 5:25pm

KonaGirl wrote:
inzane wrote:To be honest if I am just out riding I usually just use water... but if I was actually racing (especially anything that was over a couple of hours) I would definitely use a sports drink. You can go harder for longer when you are getting the carbohydrate and electrolyte replacement.

Can't say I have ever felt the need to put salt into my water, but then I dont tend to cramp much...

I make my own Gu, but for isotonic sports drink I can just grab ready made stuff from work (has sugar and colour etc in it...) so I just use that.


ha, thought you'd made your own.
Dare i say it, this is all for a half I'm doing in a few weeks. Running in the heat I feel like I need some electrolyte replacement as I'm losing heaps. Would usually just use water.
Do you follow the recipe you gave before for your GU?


Ha, running is bad for you... ok??

I really have done next to no running at all since I was last coming to see you for massages!!

My Gu, I am using honey (for the fructose) and then the major ingredients (maltodextrin, water, sea salt) from the link above. I have thrown a couple of other goodies in there that were floating around the lab. Again, just use rice malt, and add some of your salt for electrolytes and something for flavour. I used to use Rice Malt and concentrated blackcurrant juice (for flavour) mixed together when I was training for Coast etc. Worked fine for me!

If you have a gu mixed up with electrolytes in it, you may not need to put anything in your water as long as you can take regular gulps of the goo... Definitely take Muskets advice!! Try everything in training a couple of times to make sure your body is ok with it!! Nothing worse than having a bad race because your nutrition does not agree with you!!
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby danose on Sun 1/Feb/09 5:41pm

inzane wrote:Ha, running is bad for you... ok??

I really have done next to no running at all since I was last coming to see you for massages!!


indeed - what happened to your cunning plan to ease back into it and do the mt isobel last year! what'd we end up doing - 2-3 runs? :blush:

you should come out with me - whilst I was doing ok over the break I now haven't been for a run in nearly 2 weeks :blush:

and elissa - good on you, hope you have fun!!!!! I've done 1/2M distance with zero fluid intake before (can't drink when breathing that hard), so I wouldn't worry too much about sport drink - pre-hydrate and maybe grad a quick slurp at the aid stations
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby KonaGirl on Sun 1/Feb/09 6:17pm

danose wrote:
inzane wrote:Ha, running is bad for you... ok??

I really have done next to no running at all since I was last coming to see you for massages!!


indeed - what happened to your cunning plan to ease back into it and do the mt isobel last year! what'd we end up doing - 2-3 runs? :blush:

you should come out with me - whilst I was doing ok over the break I now haven't been for a run in nearly 2 weeks :blush:

and elissa - good on you, hope you have fun!!!!! I've done 1/2M distance with zero fluid intake before (can't drink when breathing that hard), so I wouldn't worry too much about sport drink - pre-hydrate and maybe grad a quick slurp at the aid stations


I don't know about that John, I've heard the buller gorge can get really hot and to be perfectly frank I don't glow I sweat and it's damn salty so if it's a hot like it's been the last few weeks I'll suffer without some help. i've got a great runners camel pack and am happy to carry something. But the question was also aimed at getting some info in general to be used with other races.
Zane I was talking to a friend of yours Glyn (who's partner jess is a friend of a friend of mine) who said you guys had done a race in Wanaka where you won with no training. So you don't even need to train to win races. No wonder you haven't been running!
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby wachtourak on Sun 1/Feb/09 6:22pm

Is it cool to hate on Powerade these days? I must have missed that memo
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby Nick_K on Sun 1/Feb/09 6:30pm

wachtourak wrote:Is it cool to hate on Powerade these days? I must have missed that memo


Powerade is a shit sports drink. Much to sugary.

To hijack the topic does anyone know a sports drink with magnesium in it? I have found magnesium (in the form of crampstop + tablets on race days) to be effective in helping prevent cramps.
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby pb on Sun 1/Feb/09 7:04pm

Nick_K wrote:To hijack the topic does anyone know a sports drink with magnesium in it? I have found magnesium (in the form of crampstop + tablets on race days) to be effective in helping prevent cramps.


I use Horleys replace hydration powder (lemon/lime normally).

per 100mL:
Sodium 55mg (2.5mmol)
Potassium 22mg (0.8mmol)
Magnesium 5mg (0.2mmol)
Calcium 8mg (0.2mmol)
Carbs Total 7.2g
- Glucose 2.6g
- Fructose 1.7g
- Glucose Polymers 2.8g
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby danose on Sun 1/Feb/09 7:13pm

KonaGirl wrote:I don't know about that John, I've heard the buller gorge can get really hot


that's the understatment to end them all!!!

ice in camelbak time (keeps your back a bit cooler - and icy cold fluids are the bees knees in 30+ temps - instant core temp drop)
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby KonaGirl on Sun 1/Feb/09 7:52pm

danose wrote:
KonaGirl wrote:I don't know about that John, I've heard the buller gorge can get really hot


that's the understatment to end them all!!!

ice in camelbak time (keeps your back a bit cooler - and icy cold fluids are the bees knees in 30+ temps - instant core temp drop)

Brilliant plan, thanks.
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby inzane on Sun 1/Feb/09 7:56pm

Nick_K wrote:
To hijack the topic does anyone know a sports drink with magnesium in it? I have found magnesium (in the form of crampstop + tablets on race days) to be effective in helping prevent cramps.


Isofuel has magnesium too... I would think that most well formulated sports drink formulas would have some??

http://www.isofuel.co.nz/

Made here in NZ!!
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby pb on Sun 1/Feb/09 10:34pm

pb
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby R-Line on Thu 12/Jul/12 4:26pm

Firstly, my company makes electrolyte drinks [spam] and I have a lot of expertise on the topic. I also have a degree in food technology. I saw this series of posts and wanted to make a few frank comments. Unfortunately there is a lot of bad information out there, especially on the internet, which makes it difficult for athletes to make good nutrition choices.

Yes, you can make your own sports drinks, but its not as simple as adding a bit of salt to Raro or Vitafresh.

Starting with Raro, it is predominantly sucrose and therefore the ratio of glucose to fructose is too low. A high fructose content can cause gastro-intestinal problems and its actually against the law in NZ and Aus to produce an electrolyte drink with too much fructose - yes, there's actually a law.

However, you want some fructose in there because glucose and fructose are absorbed by separate non competing pathways. The ultimate sports drink does contain both, but there is a bit of debate going on as to the ideal ratio. A 2:1 ratio has been suggested over the last few years, but recent research at Massey University has improved on that ratio.

Magnesium is often believed to help with cramp during sports and this is why it is added to sports drinks. There is currently no credible research available to suggest magnesium, added to a sports drink will help with cramp. Furthermore, the quantities that are usually added are absolutely tiny - just enough to make a marketing claim. Likewise potassium and calcium have not been shown to be useful in a sports drink. Sodium is the only electrolyte shown to be useful. If you want some links to some good research on this I'm happy to send it through.

As I said above, sodium is the only electrolyte worth using, therefore your Himilayan salt will be fine, as will sea salt, however, it will be no better than normal table salt. Sorry about that, using himilayan salt does sound good!

As for the rice malt, if I'm not mistaken, that will be predominantly maltose, which breaks down into glucose. By using this you are missing out on the fructose component which can help you perform better.

Lemon juice is a good idea as it will add a little acid. This will protect the product from bacterial growth which could make you sick. It will still be susceptible to yeast and mold growth though.

For total carbohydrate content, there is a lot of differing specifications out there. Generally 4-8% is quoted. The higher the sugar content the harder its likely to be on your stomach. This is why a lot of people struggle with gels. If you don't wash them down with a lot of water they will significantly slow down gastric emptying.

As for the total amount of electrolytes. For a recovery drink, you want a very high level. Most literature quotes between 30-60mmol/L. Oral rehydration salts recommended by the WHO are 75mmol sodium. My product is the only one I know of within that range (39mmol). There are a couple of others in the NZ market at 25mmol. While you are competing it is less important that it is high, but high is a safer bet.

As for Berocca, it is high in B-vitamins. There are plenty of review articles out there that say B-vitamins don't help. One of them, nicotinic acid might be detrimental.

Sugar free options... they are a waste of time, you are just buying salt, and expensive salt at that. While you are competing you need sugars, if you're not going far enough to warrant the sugars, then you don't need the salt. Likewise, the hydration salts you buy from the chemist are for treating diarrhea and vomiting and are not suitable for athletes because they don't contain enough salt.

Lastly, maltodextrin breaks down to glucose extremely quickly in the body. Some companies describe it as long chain and complex, its not. Maltodextin has a higher GI than pure glucose, that means it raises your blood glucose level faster than pure glucose.

Here is a couple of fantastic references for some more info about sports drinks and cramp.
http://ec.europa.eu/food/fs/sc/scf/out64_en.pdf
http://journals.lww.com/acsm-csmr/Fullt ... _or.9.aspx

As for our product [it tastes like spam]

I'm also more than happy to offer a small discount to anyone who has managed to read this far down! [spam]
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby cruiser on Thu 12/Jul/12 4:49pm

that's about the best spam I've ever read on Vorb, cheers Rline. Nice idea with the concentrate too.
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby Trail on Thu 12/Jul/12 5:02pm

Ha, nice thread dredge! Good to see a considered reply, even if it looks like you only just signed up to Vorb to reply to this post to try and advertise your own product :D

I think you will find that the poster Inzane also has a degree in Food Technology from Massey and was working for a Food Tech company at the time and knows a thing or 2 about endurance racing and sports nutrition as well :sly:
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby RussS on Thu 12/Jul/12 5:22pm

musket wrote:You can probably get hold of medical grade electrolyte - gastrolyte powder if you ask nicely. It's cheap and very effective.


That is the best stuff to use. These days I will have a bottle of that and a bottle of iced tea - or two for a long ride.
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Re: Homemade Electrolyte Drink

Postby MissChaff on Thu 12/Jul/12 6:40pm

R-Line wrote:
I'm also more than happy to offer a small discount to anyone who has managed to read this far down!


I'm keen- how do I redeem small discount for a try-out?
thx
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