General Election - Leaders' Debates

Kevin Hague · *by **Kevin Hague** on Mon 31/Oct/11 4:56pm*

So, in case you didn't know, November 26th will be General Election day. Hope you're enrolled to vote! (if not https://secure.elections.org.nz/app/enrol/)

But what this post is about is that, despite our having had proportional representation for quite a while now, quite a bit of media coverage of the election continues to use a '2 horse race' template for stories, as if we still had that kind of electoral system. Nowhere is this more obvious than in the 'leaders' debates' on TVNZ and TV3. The first of these kicks off on TVNZ tonight.

We tried to persuade TVNZ that one of the Green co-leaders should also be involved in at least some of the debates, but TVNZ (along with Key and Goff) refused.

So we are doing our own thing. Check out http://www.greens.org.nz/greenroom From 7pm tonight we will be live streaming firstly a panel discussion with David Slack, Irene Pink and Nandor Tanczos, and then once the TVNZ debate concludes Finlay MacDonald will interview Russel and Metiria about the issues with expert guest commentators. We think this is a first in NZ politics, and of course our format allows for emailed, texted audience questions etc. For example I will be online as well helping respond to questions and comments. Hope you can join us!

Mickyfinn · *by **Mickyfinn** on Mon 31/Oct/11 8:39pm*

Do you think you can be taken seriously

pushbikerider · *by **pushbikerider** on Mon 31/Oct/11 8:42pm*

Mickyfinn wrote:Do you think you can be taken seriously

Many users of this website ask the same question about you

brian245 · *by **brian245** on Mon 31/Oct/11 8:52pm*

pushbikerider wrote:
Mickyfinn wrote:Do you think you can be taken seriously

Many users of this website ask the same question about you

I think they are just there to make up the numbers, certainly not to be taken seriously

MattV · *by **MattV** on Mon 31/Oct/11 8:56pm*

I'm going to abstain from making any comment on who i'm voting for

znomit · *by **znomit** on Mon 31/Oct/11 8:59pm*

brian245 wrote:
pushbikerider wrote:
Mickyfinn wrote:Do you think you can be taken seriously

Many users of this website ask the same question about you

I think they are just there to make up the numbers, certainly not to be taken seriously

What number is MF?

ps, JK had me at "Oh, yeah I lied about the GST thing but hey look at my smile".

RussS · *by **RussS** on Mon 31/Oct/11 9:11pm*

Enrolled, but to be fair the muppets listed are all much of a muchness. Damn I am sick of politics already.

I think we need to get moving and make changes. I have read a couple things recently that struck home quite succinctly.

Warren Buffett, "I could end the deficit in 5 minutes," he told CNBC. "You just pass a law that says that anytime there is a deficit of more than 3% of GDP, all
sitting members of Congress are ineligible for re-election. The 26th
amendment (granting the right to vote for 18 year-olds) took only 3 months
& 8 days to be ratified! Why? Simple! The people demanded it. That was in
1971...before computers, e-mail, cell phones, etc. Of the 27 amendments to
the Constitution, seven (7) took 1 year or less to become the law of the
land...all because of public pressure.

Warren Buffet is asking each addressee to forward this email to a minimum of
twenty people on their address list; in turn ask each of those to do
likewise.
In three days, most people in The United States of America will have the
message. This is one idea that really should be passed around.

The second is something from a political action group stateside.

*Congressional Reform Act of 2011*

1. No Tenure / No Pension. A Congressman collects a salary while in office
and receives no pay when they are out of office.

2. Congress (past, present & future) participates in Social Security. All
funds in the Congressional retirement fund move to the Social Security
system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system,
and Congress participates with the American people. It may not be used for
any other purpose.

3. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan, just as all Americans
do.

4. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay
will rise by the lower of CPI or 3%.

5. Congress loses their current health care system and participates in the
same health care system as the American people.

6. Congress must equally abide by all laws they impose on the American
people.

7. All contracts with past and present Congressmen are void effective 1/1/12.
The American people did not make this contract with Congressmen. Congressmen
made all these contracts for themselves. Serving in Congress is an honor,
not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, so ours
should serve their term's), then go home and back to work.

Both of them are about American politics, but to be fair relate to our own system and many others in the so-called free world.
Face it, the reason most people get into politics is not to serve, but to either get what they can for themselves and their families, or to indulge in a personal power trip. Those that serve to make change, are usually only interested in that if it benefits themselves directly.

Ban ploitical parties and we might just start moving ahead.

bugle · *by **bugle** on Mon 31/Oct/11 9:31pm*

Dont let the hologram sell our big things

AJK · *by **AJK** on Mon 31/Oct/11 9:39pm*

RussS wrote:Face it, the reason most people get into politics is not to serve, but to either get what they can for themselves and their families, or to indulge in a personal power trip. Those that serve to make change, are usually only interested in that if it benefits themselves directly.

Bollocks. There must be an easier way to get income/power without the work hours, media, and internet forum bullshit. Investment banking, perhaps?

happybaboon · *by **happybaboon** on Mon 31/Oct/11 9:48pm*

Key can't pronounce words correctly (I liked how Guyon Espiner goaded him into saying "Dinnimic" an extra time for lols), but Goff doesn't have a personality. I'm calling the debate a draw. It's a huge shame that Winnie and someone from the Greens couldn't be there to class it up a bit (but then I guess they'd have had to have had Brash and Peter Dumb there too, which would have made it sucky). So... meh.

happybaboon · *by **happybaboon** on Tue 1/Nov/11 1:23pm*

https://www.ipredict.co.nz/app.php?do=browse&cat=164
Finding it quite interesting to watch how this thing reacts to the goings on in the election campaign. Seems to be suggesting that Goff did well last night, though Key is still miles and miles ahead.

CrustyMTB · *by **CrustyMTB** on Tue 1/Nov/11 8:26pm*

I rode past a whoellloooooooolllllllllle bunch of elections signs t'other day and I got really sick of Don Keys gurning face, those fuckers are gutting the human infrastructure of this country and making life easier for millionaires, at the expense of everyone else. Vote for anyone but National, they are untrustworthy halfsmart inbreds.

happybaboon · *by **happybaboon** on Tue 1/Nov/11 8:36pm*

On the subject of their billboards ... you can still use the National website to send National billboards with Don Brash on them to your friends

http://www.national.org.nz/ecards.aspx

wuffy · *by **wuffy** on Tue 1/Nov/11 8:43pm*

New benefit reforms are intredasting.

nostromo · *by **nostromo** on Tue 1/Nov/11 8:48pm*

CrustyMTB wrote:I rode past a whoellloooooooolllllllllle bunch of elections signs t'other day and I got really sick of Don Keys gurning face, those fuckers are gutting the human infrastructure of this country and making life easier for millionaires, at the expense of everyone else. Vote for anyone but National, they are untrustworthy halfsmart inbreds.

ACT then?

General Election - Leaders' Debates

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