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jeremyb
BRAP BRAP BRAP BRAP
Joined: Jan 12, 2003
Posts: 32,882
Location: Derailled
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 Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 10:07am Post subject: |
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| Dazzle wrote: | Supposedly air rifles are used by lifestyle block owners to kill pests on their property without requiring the expense of a firearms license.
It killed him before the back up around the corner got to him. How much more effective a weapon do they need to be?
So, you would prefer to be shot at close range by one rather than have it swung at you baseball bat style?
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He was shot multiple times at close range with a .22 air rifle, I see no issue with making the powerful air rifles require firearms license ownership, however you're talking about lawful citizens, albeit life sentence block owners... the bad guys will still get firearms without a license, its only a preventive measure for the lazy crims.
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chalky
Wrecked
Joined: May 01, 2006
Posts: 5,934
Location: Timaru
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 10:19am Post subject: |
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| herbman wrote: | | Flyboy wrote: |  40ft/sec.
holy wobbler beans thats powerful.
yes it is. |
40 fps is rather slow in the high power air gun game, most will do close 1000 fps |
Yeh even a paintball gun shoots at well over 300 fps
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Dazzle
Mangled
Joined: Feb 11, 2002
Posts: 12,976
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 10:26am Post subject: |
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Lazy crims - is their any other kind? 
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ssipface
Boneshaker
Joined: Jan 28, 2003
Posts: 17,513
Location: Planet Claire
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 10:30am Post subject: |
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if you check the auction it says the rifle is modified to 40 ft / lbs, not 40 fps . i think that's talking about the air pressure, not the velocity
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slidecontrol
Thrashed
Joined: Apr 09, 2007
Posts: 1,514
Location: I used to have tourettes, now I'm rolf harris
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 10:32am Post subject: |
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| ssipface wrote: | | if you check the auction it says the rifle is modified to 40 ft / lbs. i think that's talking about the air pressure, not the velocity |
+1
ft/lbs sounds like an odd unit to measure the pressure with though. Anyone know how it equates to psi?
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herbman
Flogged
Joined: May 30, 2003
Posts: 3,817
Location: the alexs, the land that time forgot
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 10:38am Post subject: |
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| slidecontrol wrote: | | ssipface wrote: | | if you check the auction it says the rifle is modified to 40 ft / lbs. i think that's talking about the air pressure, not the velocity |
+1
ft/lbs sounds like an odd unit to measure the pressure with though. Anyone know how it equates to psi? |
i had a wee looky before trying to work it back to FPS but didn't find anything. the things you do to get out of doing eurepgap.......
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Conners
Seeing Double
Joined: Jul 09, 2003
Posts: 4,083
Location: bjcfilms editing suite, Welly
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 10:57am Post subject: |
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ft/lbs is a non unit.
PSI = pounds per square inch (force per unit area)
Torque = foot pounds (ie distance * force)
ft/lbs = distance per force? Makes no sense to me at all.
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scatter
More beige than usual
Joined: Jan 19, 2003
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Conners
Seeing Double
Joined: Jul 09, 2003
Posts: 4,083
Location: bjcfilms editing suite, Welly
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 11:12am Post subject: |
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But all the definitions they give are for foot-pound (distance * force) as opposed to foot/pound (distance per force).
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Slim
Mangled
Joined: Aug 15, 2003
Posts: 16,717
Location: Opawa
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 12:27pm Post subject: |
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| Conners wrote: | | But all the definitions they give are for foot-pound (distance * force) as opposed to foot/pound (distance per force). |
its kcollobs, he's giving something that appears to be a pressure as a torque, It means nothing with its current units
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Purple_Helmet
Ridden
Joined: Jul 26, 2006
Posts: 200
Location: Taranaki
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 12:29pm Post subject: |
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An error in a trademong auction post? Unbegnikcuflievable.
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Conners
Seeing Double
Joined: Jul 09, 2003
Posts: 4,083
Location: bjcfilms editing suite, Welly
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 12:38pm Post subject: |
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As foot/pound he's not even giving a talking torque (sic) 
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GraemeWi
Head over heels
Joined: Jul 22, 2002
Posts: 1,119
Location: Planet Auckland
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 12:47pm Post subject: |
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It's an expression of the energy the pellet on impact. Feet per second is a pretty rubbish measurement as people can get a very high velocity with a ultra light pellet that contains no energy.
I have a air .22 springer for dealing to rats.
Cheers,
G
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radical_edward
Flogged
Joined: Mar 10, 2004
Posts: 3,894
Location: Bodymore, Murderland
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 1:18pm Post subject: |
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| Slim wrote: | | Conners wrote: | | But all the definitions they give are for foot-pound (distance * force) as opposed to foot/pound (distance per force). |
its kcollobs, he's giving something that appears to be a pressure as a torque, It means nothing with its current units |
No, it is not kcollobs. Ft/lbs is a common measure of muzzle energy in a firearm:
http://pyramydair.com/site/articles/formulas/
40ft/lbs is a lot for an air rifle, but is not that much in the scheme of things. That power level will let you take down a possum or a hare in a humane manner hitting pretty much anywhere on the body, but there is a big gap between that and 'real' fire arms. .22 LR is around 90-100 ft/lbs. .303 is around 2200-2500 ft/lbs.
There is an arms amendment bill on the table that will mean anything above 26 ft/lbs will require a license. Most spring powered air rifles are between 8 and 18 ft/lbs, so there is no issue there. The serious end of air rifle hunting will be unfairly restricted though, as you can get a second hand .22 for as little as $50 if you have a fire arms license.
These things do not need to be put in the same class as a .303. Firstly, they are expensive, at around $1500-2500 and require the additional purchase of a scuba tank or a $300+ high pressure hand pump to fill. Secondly, it was an extremely unlucky shot that killed that undercover policeman, who had already taken a beating. The guys that did it had illegal pistols and rifles. I think that they took the air rifle with the intention to maim the shady person who was messing with their car, rather than to kill.
If you are serious about getting into crime, are you going to spend thousands on an air rifle or hundreds on a black market .22 and ammunition?
PCP air rifles are humane, multi shot and extremely quiet, so they make ideal rabbit hunting tools. They should be subsidised in this country rather than effectively banned.
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Conners
Seeing Double
Joined: Jul 09, 2003
Posts: 4,083
Location: bjcfilms editing suite, Welly
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| Posted: Wed 29/Oct/08 1:24pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for that Ed.
My pedantic argument still stands that it is foot-pound, not foot/pound (that's footpound, not foot per pound) 
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