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SaturnReturn
Scuffed
Joined: Oct 17, 2004
Posts: 314
Location: Auckland
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 Posted: Wed 22/Oct/08 4:11pm Post subject: |
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Yeah they won't give that info as your target heart rate zones etc vary from person to person according to fitness/physiology etc.
From experience (given your above quoted example) I would find it impossible to do a 4 hour ride staying at 70%...the minute I hit a steep hill I would have to be on some crazy granny gear to maintain that HR and then achieving a fast hill climb would go out the window.
They are really a subjective tool for you to guage how YOU are going, not to tell you how hard to pedal (if that makes sense).
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Fergie
Wrecked
Joined: Jun 04, 2006
Posts: 5,340
Location: Christchurch
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| Posted: Wed 22/Oct/08 4:15pm Post subject: |
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Most should have the basics of working out training zones based on max heart rate.
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wobbly01
Scuffed
Joined: Jul 24, 2007
Posts: 500
Location: Dunedin/Nelson
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| Posted: Wed 22/Oct/08 4:18pm Post subject: |
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| UK_Exile wrote: | | wobbly01 wrote: | | UK_Exile wrote: | Also I've know idea what you're talking about regarding zones, rates etc. We just get out and ride and aren't generally into techy toys or reading trendy sports mags. I assume they come with decent manuals explaining all that stuff ???
The coach said very useful for endurance and it would helpful to avoid temptation to ride too hard too early and find later stages hard. |
I could be wrong but I don't imagine the HRM would be all that useful for pacing yourself unless you have some prior knowledge of what sort of HR you can maintain and for how long. To find this out you would have to do extensive riding and racing with a HRM. Therefore unless you are planning on doing a lot of training with a heart rate monitor you may as well just stick to how you feel in your race.
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Sounds like getting them may not be much use for 8th Nov then as we'll only get chance to use a couple of times on longer rides before then.
I take it they don't really come with manuals saying person to exercise at say up to 90% if 1hr max exersize and 80% if 2-4hrs, 70% if 4+hrs, etc ????......complete newbie questions I know ! |
They probably will but HR varies hugely from person to person, eg. as a rule of thumb 221 minus your age gives your max HR. I'm 22 so in theorie mine should be 199 but I've never seen it above 190.
Oh and again fergie, for cycling rectal core temp isn't idea as your legs overheating tends to raise your measured core temp from what it actually is. For cycling oseophagal temp is better but sticking a themoeter so far down you nose it comes down to the level of your heart really isn't fun!
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SaturnReturn
Scuffed
Joined: Oct 17, 2004
Posts: 314
Location: Auckland
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| Posted: Wed 22/Oct/08 4:21pm Post subject: |
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| Fergie wrote: | | Most should have the basics of working out training zones based on max heart rate. |
yeah thats right, I guess i was trying to say (and not soing it very well) that those zones will vary from person to person depending on what your max HR is.
I'm sure the pros can offer better advice than me haha! 
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Fergie
Wrecked
Joined: Jun 04, 2006
Posts: 5,340
Location: Christchurch
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| Posted: Wed 22/Oct/08 4:22pm Post subject: |
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Thanks Dave, saved me from some painful self-experimentation.
220 - age is a joke. One of the local ex phys people used that as the basis of his Masters disertation. I'm 37 and my max is 203.
Ride up a long hill going harder and harder and then sprint over the top!
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FLATULENTFRIEND
Scuffed
Joined: Oct 04, 2008
Posts: 439
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| Posted: Wed 22/Oct/08 4:52pm Post subject: |
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Don't get a HRM. Full stop.
As another poster has said trying to maintain 70% for an MTB race would be impossible.
Its hard enough on the road trying to maintain it with changing conditions, traffic, hills etc.
There is no point. 
Only get one if you're going to get a good book or two(and they exist) on training with them and then get into zone training and be very scientific about it.
I've done the HRM thing for years and this year gave up on them.
I've found just riding with hard days/ easy days, different courses, racing, riding in groups etc is much more effective and less restricting than trying to rely on the sometimes changing info from a HRM.
Sure it nice to see some more infor while riding but if its not useful - what's the point?
Polar - I have an S15O - which is pretty useless for( road) cycling as it doesn't have cadence (want to buy it?).
The fork mount (speed etc) packed up and needs replacing.
I have a Polar CS200 as well which was excellent until it wasn't (occasionally).
Wanna buy it?
Go into overseas cycling forums and you'll see a very mixed response to Polar.
The balance would be they're not that great - but they all have their faul  .
I've gone back to the trusty Cateye Astrale 8.
Its simple, lasts well(I've sold about 30 of them) and has all a roadie needs - Cadence + the basics. 
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Fergie
Wrecked
Joined: Jun 04, 2006
Posts: 5,340
Location: Christchurch
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| Posted: Wed 22/Oct/08 5:04pm Post subject: |
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I disagree. Polar, if set up properly and if you get some basic paremeters right is very usefull. I frequent most International forums (surprised) and don't see too much bagging of Polar except their Power measuring system. But most of that is user error.
True a power meter (SRM or Powertap) is the ideal but one would only invest that sort of money if they had National level goals. I wouldn't use any form of measurement while racing. I would prefer riders keep an eye on the road. Like Wobbly1 I download the information afterwards.
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UK_Exile
Dusty
Joined: Jun 23, 2005
Posts: 122
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| Posted: Wed 22/Oct/08 5:37pm Post subject: |
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| SaturnReturn wrote: |
They are really a subjective tool for you to guage how YOU are going, not to tell you how hard to pedal (if that makes sense). |
That seems to make sense. All the above posts have been usefule but they almost read like it's too much hassle and probably isn't worth doing anyway for MTB riding.
My guess of 70% was just a completely uninformed guess as I've know idea if a sensible target would be 50% or 80% of max for X hrs duration. I certainly can see how it would be near impossible to maintain a constant rate on anything but a completely calm day, flat road, constant air temp, constant food intake etc.
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wobbly01
Scuffed
Joined: Jul 24, 2007
Posts: 500
Location: Dunedin/Nelson
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| Posted: Wed 22/Oct/08 8:27pm Post subject: |
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I recon what it comes down too is that they are an awesome tool for training (unless you can afford a power meter) but you need someone who knows abit about them to tell you how to use it. They're great if you have a coach.
For racing they have some use but usually the pace seems to be dictated by others/ the course etc.
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Iceberg
Shiny
Joined: Oct 28, 2007
Posts: 31
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| Posted: Wed 22/Oct/08 10:32pm Post subject: |
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I agree, after a race I've often heard people say they looked at their HRM over the first few km and realised they were way over the top. Next step was to ignore the HRM. Who wants to be dropped?
So why, I ask myself, did they wear their HRM at all? Because they had a plan when they started to keep within certain limits. In the heat of the moment the plan went out the window.
About the only useful thing that came out of the last race was us all having a good look at how high his HR was compared to his MAx, etc. afterwards.
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Elden
Ridden
Joined: Mar 01, 2008
Posts: 252
Location: Coffee Shop
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| Posted: Thu 23/Oct/08 12:29am Post subject: |
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Make your key training simulate the racing! Work yourself as hard in training as you do in a race. A HRM or better, a power meter, is a simple tool to view the effort you are producing or need to produce to train for the conditions of racing. buy them for the training tool that they are and not as meaning less numbers on the handle bar like many do. If you need help understanding how to use them or understanding the numbers, hire a coach to guide you through a program.
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UK_Exile
Dusty
Joined: Jun 23, 2005
Posts: 122
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| Posted: Thu 23/Oct/08 8:09am Post subject: |
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We don't have the cash for coaching and since we only do 4 or 5 races per year can't justify it one anyway. Seems like HRM is a good training toy but useless for anything else. We probably get some but won't rush out today and will look around for mid range used ones, probably polar brand it seems.
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psychavoc
Ph.D. (Vorbology)
Joined: Jul 17, 2003
Posts: 24,234
Location: Welly-town
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| Posted: Sat 25/Oct/08 8:03pm Post subject: |
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FYI - I was looking through the weekend paper today and Rebel Sport have the basic Polar FS1 model HR monitor for half price down to $60 from $120, so that's a pretty good deal for a very basic (but by the sounds of it, reliable) HRM
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mtbrat
Huge Tracts of Land
Joined: Feb 13, 2003
Posts: 13,489
Location: Shaven Haven
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| Posted: Sat 25/Oct/08 8:05pm Post subject: |
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I picked up a couple of Polar's from Rebel, good place for sales, just don't expect any real advice there.
But hey, that's what the intermenet is for...
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dhroadie
Flogged
Joined: Sep 26, 2006
Posts: 2,247
Location: hardly anywhere
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| Posted: Sun 26/Oct/08 2:57pm Post subject: |
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My Polar CS100 is less than a year old but the strap thingy has started playing up. Often it doesn't pick up my HR - have tried tightening it and this works some of the time. Is there a battery or something that needs replacing inside there? Unit itself works fine, is just the chest strap seems to be having a few issues.
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