Joined: Nov 13, 2005 Posts: 4,569 Location: Loving LA
Posted: Fri 4th Jul 9:42pm Post subject:
CrustyMTB wrote:
ryda wrote:
Nick_K wrote:
ryda wrote:
CrustyMTB wrote:
ryda wrote:
benw wrote:
I think Scotty's comments on the first page of this thread sum it up nicely.
kcids.
Don't ever complain about the price of milk and cheese
Student protested about loans today, but of course they're just privileged middle class types, not salt of the earth blue collars...
But then don't complain about a lack of Doctors and the brain drain eh?!
I have never complained about doctors striking .....neither but then I guess going by a post above doctors are actually should never strike
Your sentence makes no sense Ryda.
I didn't strike, hths
I never said you did strike
you said the truck drivers are idoits for striking, do you say doctors are idiots for striking also ?
To be honest I'm not 100% sure what Crusty's was trying to say
I was trying to draw a parallel between what student and truckies are trying to acheive, (reduced profits vs starting working life with large debts) and the attitudes of of the heaving mass of vorb posters being pro truckies, despite the fact that the loss of talent through the brain-drain is a much larger threat to our national prosperity...
So how much do you think it costs to buy a big rig?
Joined: Apr 09, 2007 Posts: 1,250 Location: I used to have tourettes, now I'm rolf harris
Posted: Fri 4th Jul 10:06pm Post subject:
Its like the minimum wage thing, everyone says pay people more, but the same people then refuse to pay 10 bucks for a hamburger to cover those wage increases, so it goes around and around....
3) 18 wheels really REALLY kcuf the road, if you were to do a weight/wheel comparison you'd probably find truckies don't do so bad! (not the most salient of points, I know...)
I'm going to be a roznuc here and point out that the majority of 44 tonne GCM (thats Gross combined mass) vehicles have more than 18 wheels. In fact the last time I saw a unit with 18 wheels it was loaded to 32 or so tonnes (actually I was driving the exact setup today).
An 8 axle unit has 28 wheels which are usually 275 or 295mm wide. If we take the weight to be 44 tonnes gross each tyre exerts around 1.57 tonnes on the road surface. Which in the grand scheme of things is kcuf all.
As for the protests, the silly kcirps driving at 5kph on the southern motorway really kcufed things up. That sort of behaviour is just plain dumb and I would hope they lose their jobs for being such arrogant basdrats.
I appreciate the sentiment, but unfortunatley you`re incorrect. Accepted industry figures put the damage caused by trucks at betwen 4000 and 10000 times that of a passenger car. When designing pavements we don`t even consider the car traffic, anything less than 1 ESA (80kN) is ignored as irrelevant.
The flexible pavements used in NZ wear out via fatigue, and cars simply arent heavy enough to fatigue any road pavement (unless its saturated).
The big problem is that the funding available for roading is decreasing as vehicles get more fuel efficient, and since the MOT guaranteed Hypothecation - all road tax income to be spent on roading it needs to be cost neutral now. A few projects like waterview require a lot of capital investment.
Trucks have underpaid for years, and we`ve all be subsiding them. No wonder rail never had a chance for line haul when truckies could get diesel for 45c /l and pay stuff all for the roads...
The government needs rail so that we can have an integrated sustainable transport network - look for big changes in the transport sector in the next few months
Joined: Mar 15, 2002 Posts: 13,888 Location: Not quite sure yet...
Posted: Fri 4th Jul 10:40pm Post subject:
Logger wrote:
Scotty wrote:
3) 18 wheels really REALLY kcuf the road, if you were to do a weight/wheel comparison you'd probably find truckies don't do so bad! (not the most salient of points, I know...)
I'm going to be a roznuc here and point out that the majority of 44 tonne GCM (thats Gross combined mass) vehicles have more than 18 wheels. In fact the last time I saw a unit with 18 wheels it was loaded to 32 or so tonnes (actually I was driving the exact setup today).
An 8 axle unit has 28 wheels which are usually 275 or 295mm wide. If we take the weight to be 44 tonnes gross each tyre exerts around 1.57 tonnes on the road surface. Which in the grand scheme of things is kcuf all.
As for the protests, the silly kcirps driving at 5kph on the southern motorway really kcufed things up. That sort of behaviour is just plain dumb and I would hope they lose their jobs for being such arrogant basdrats.
I was waiting for you to show up on this one dude...
I was wanting to hear from someone who's actually in the thick of it.
Joined: May 25, 2004 Posts: 11,040 Location: V8 Street Race NZ
Posted: Fri 4th Jul 10:52pm Post subject:
Nikolai_V wrote:
Logger wrote:
Scotty wrote:
3) 18 wheels really REALLY kcuf the road, if you were to do a weight/wheel comparison you'd probably find truckies don't do so bad! (not the most salient of points, I know...)
I'm going to be a roznuc here and point out that the majority of 44 tonne GCM (thats Gross combined mass) vehicles have more than 18 wheels. In fact the last time I saw a unit with 18 wheels it was loaded to 32 or so tonnes (actually I was driving the exact setup today).
An 8 axle unit has 28 wheels which are usually 275 or 295mm wide. If we take the weight to be 44 tonnes gross each tyre exerts around 1.57 tonnes on the road surface. Which in the grand scheme of things is kcuf all.
As for the protests, the silly kcirps driving at 5kph on the southern motorway really kcufed things up. That sort of behaviour is just plain dumb and I would hope they lose their jobs for being such arrogant basdrats.
I appreciate the sentiment, but unfortunatley you`re incorrect. Accepted industry figures put the damage caused by trucks at betwen 4000 and 10000 times that of a passenger car. When designing pavements we don`t even consider the car traffic, anything less than 1 ESA (80kN) is ignored as irrelevant.
The flexible pavements used in NZ wear out via fatigue, and cars simply arent heavy enough to fatigue any road pavement (unless its saturated).
The big problem is that the funding available for roading is decreasing as vehicles get more fuel efficient, and since the MOT guaranteed Hypothecation - all road tax income to be spent on roading it needs to be cost neutral now. A few projects like waterview require a lot of capital investment.
Trucks have underpaid for years, and we`ve all be subsiding them. No wonder rail never had a chance for line haul when truckies could get diesel for 45c /l and pay stuff all for the roads...
The government needs rail so that we can have an integrated sustainable transport network - look for big changes in the transport sector in the next few months
Joined: Nov 13, 2005 Posts: 4,569 Location: Loving LA
Posted: Fri 4th Jul 10:55pm Post subject:
Datsane wrote:
Nikolai_V wrote:
Logger wrote:
Scotty wrote:
3) 18 wheels really REALLY kcuf the road, if you were to do a weight/wheel comparison you'd probably find truckies don't do so bad! (not the most salient of points, I know...)
I'm going to be a roznuc here and point out that the majority of 44 tonne GCM (thats Gross combined mass) vehicles have more than 18 wheels. In fact the last time I saw a unit with 18 wheels it was loaded to 32 or so tonnes (actually I was driving the exact setup today).
An 8 axle unit has 28 wheels which are usually 275 or 295mm wide. If we take the weight to be 44 tonnes gross each tyre exerts around 1.57 tonnes on the road surface. Which in the grand scheme of things is kcuf all.
As for the protests, the silly kcirps driving at 5kph on the southern motorway really kcufed things up. That sort of behaviour is just plain dumb and I would hope they lose their jobs for being such arrogant basdrats.
I appreciate the sentiment, but unfortunatley you`re incorrect. Accepted industry figures put the damage caused by trucks at betwen 4000 and 10000 times that of a passenger car. When designing pavements we don`t even consider the car traffic, anything less than 1 ESA (80kN) is ignored as irrelevant.
The flexible pavements used in NZ wear out via fatigue, and cars simply arent heavy enough to fatigue any road pavement (unless its saturated).
The big problem is that the funding available for roading is decreasing as vehicles get more fuel efficient, and since the MOT guaranteed Hypothecation - all road tax income to be spent on roading it needs to be cost neutral now. A few projects like waterview require a lot of capital investment.
Trucks have underpaid for years, and we`ve all be subsiding them. No wonder rail never had a chance for line haul when truckies could get diesel for 45c /l and pay stuff all for the roads...
The government needs rail so that we can have an integrated sustainable transport network - look for big changes in the transport sector in the next few months
So how much does a Diesel train pay per litre
Dont they get cheaper Diesel as its not going to be used on a road. I remember reading that somewhere.
3) 18 wheels really REALLY kcuf the road, if you were to do a weight/wheel comparison you'd probably find truckies don't do so bad! (not the most salient of points, I know...)
I'm going to be a roznuc here and point out that the majority of 44 tonne GCM (thats Gross combined mass) vehicles have more than 18 wheels. In fact the last time I saw a unit with 18 wheels it was loaded to 32 or so tonnes (actually I was driving the exact setup today).
An 8 axle unit has 28 wheels which are usually 275 or 295mm wide. If we take the weight to be 44 tonnes gross each tyre exerts around 1.57 tonnes on the road surface. Which in the grand scheme of things is kcuf all.
As for the protests, the silly kcirps driving at 5kph on the southern motorway really kcufed things up. That sort of behaviour is just plain dumb and I would hope they lose their jobs for being such arrogant basdrats.
I appreciate the sentiment, but unfortunatley you`re incorrect. Accepted industry figures put the damage caused by trucks at betwen 4000 and 10000 times that of a passenger car. When designing pavements we don`t even consider the car traffic, anything less than 1 ESA (80kN) is ignored as irrelevant.
The flexible pavements used in NZ wear out via fatigue, and cars simply arent heavy enough to fatigue any road pavement (unless its saturated).
The big problem is that the funding available for roading is decreasing as vehicles get more fuel efficient, and since the MOT guaranteed Hypothecation - all road tax income to be spent on roading it needs to be cost neutral now. A few projects like waterview require a lot of capital investment.
Trucks have underpaid for years, and we`ve all be subsiding them. No wonder rail never had a chance for line haul when truckies could get diesel for 45c /l and pay stuff all for the roads...
The government needs rail so that we can have an integrated sustainable transport network - look for big changes in the transport sector in the next few months
So how much does a Diesel train pay per litre
Dont they get cheaper Diesel as its not going to be used on a road. I remember reading that somewhere.
From memory and I stand to be corrected on this - some of the diesel electric trains run on fuel oil, rather than diesel (its a heavier fraction). Regardless they are still far more efficient that trucks. Diesel is priced on the basis that it`s not used on a legal road, hence the RUC`s that trucks and cars pay. If you`re a farmer there are refunds for mileage on farm - so theyre not paying RUC for that, same for trains and excavators etc...
Trucks do have a justification though - transport to and from rail heads and around town.
Sooner or later the crunch was due, it doesnt matter what party is in power, someone has to pay for teh maintenance of the roads. May as well be user pays, drive the electrification of the Main Trunk Line and some real efficiency in freight. Coastal shipping is mocked, but Truck and trailer units chugging up and down SH1 arent the way forward.
Joined: May 25, 2004 Posts: 11,040 Location: V8 Street Race NZ
Posted: Fri 4th Jul 11:19pm Post subject:
You are mostly right. And with the raising cost of Fuel NZ transport systems are going to get one hell of a shake up. Could be part of the reason the we got our rail system back off the Ozzie.
I see it as, when the govt wanted to introduce a extra 6c per litre Tax to Auckland only to start getting some of the public transport back on track. All the Jaffa's jumped up and down said we are paying to much for gas as it is why should we pay more, the Govt backed down.
The truckies seen this work said we do more for the country then fairying fat kids to and from school, so wheres our break.
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