Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby jimmi71 on Fri 29/May/15 6:42am

Apologies for the double post but....

I ride 4 - 6 times a week at night with a MTB headlight pointed at the ground in front of me and I find this safer than riding during the day. The other day my light went dead (not bad after 10 years use or something) so I used my backup: a 1w flasher. Bugger me if 10 minutes later a car pulls out right in front of me!

The next day I went out and splashed on a 1000lumen USB rechargeable and a AA Nightrider Mako as backup.
Moral of the story? Dont buy cheap lights!
jimmi71
Member for: 2 years 6 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Datsane on Sat 30/May/15 12:49pm

Simonk wrote:
Datsane wrote:
Simonk wrote:
danose wrote:
Simonk wrote:The Orbit output is pitiful. It didn't event register on our illuminometer (which only registers illuminance above 2.5 Lux). I think we removed it from our results because it's more like a Christmas decoration than a bike light. When riding in traffic, a bike light's gotta compete with car lights - about 600 Lux at 2 m.



well if you test it using the same methodology as a rear light that's a bit retarded. The orbit actually works well because it's flashing and rotating - which catches people's attention. Doesn't need to be super bright. I

think it's a moot point though as looking online it seems cat eye has discontinued them - hopefully they'll do something to replace it cos there's ZILCHO other options for side viz (well maybe a fibreflare type light the downtube)


I disagree. If you want something to attract the attention of drivers coming out of side-streets and driveways, you're better to rely on a bright front light with a wide beam (on flashing mode) or a helmet-mounted light that you can flash to the side. Assuming you are moving, it's the light shone at 20-45 degrees that counts (not directly side on) - the Orbit wastes most of the little light it has in directions that don't matter.

The rotating motion might be of value in attracting attention if the Orbit were bright enough to stand out against much brighter light sources. The flashing mode found on most bike lights serves a similar purpose.
Flashing front lights at night suck.
There is also a reason cars run side markers its so they can be seen at night side on. They aren't all that bright, but make a huge difference.


Flashing lights work though. No need to be obnoxious with sure-high power - as much illuminance as a car light is probably enough.
As far as side markers go, you could say 'There is also a reason they aren't require on cars or motorbikes. They don't make a huge difference'.

Here's one of the concluding comments from a well thought out article on this topic:
"Recognise the risk of being in a saccade. High contrast clothing and lights help. In particular, flashing LED’s (front and rear) are especially effective for cyclists as they create contrast and the on-off flashing attracts the peripheral vision in the same manner that movement does."
http://www.londoncyclist.co.uk/raf-pilot-teach-cyclists/

Interesting article read something similar before. But with the basis of the article wouldn't a flashing light make it worse?
Depending on the flash rate etc... of the light you have about a 50% chance of them still not seeing you, its all good if it flashes while they are looking no good if it doesn't.

Cyclist in general would be better off obeying all the road rules, not riding like a twat or light them selves up like a sun. Rather than thinking because I have x number of lumens I'm instantly going to be good, take the they haven't seen me.
Drivers need to look for and be willing to wait for something smaller than them. And not so worried about losing 30seconds on there 20min drive.

That Topeak bottle cage is mint. Should be about $55 in NZ
Datsane
User avatar
"Chiave Inglese"
Member for: 13 years 5 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Simonk on Sat 30/May/15 1:22pm

Datsane wrote:
Simonk wrote:
Datsane wrote:
Simonk wrote:
danose wrote:
Simonk wrote:The Orbit output is pitiful. It didn't event register on our illuminometer (which only registers illuminance above 2.5 Lux). I think we removed it from our results because it's more like a Christmas decoration than a bike light. When riding in traffic, a bike light's gotta compete with car lights - about 600 Lux at 2 m.



well if you test it using the same methodology as a rear light that's a bit retarded. The orbit actually works well because it's flashing and rotating - which catches people's attention. Doesn't need to be super bright. I

think it's a moot point though as looking online it seems cat eye has discontinued them - hopefully they'll do something to replace it cos there's ZILCHO other options for side viz (well maybe a fibreflare type light the downtube)


I disagree. If you want something to attract the attention of drivers coming out of side-streets and driveways, you're better to rely on a bright front light with a wide beam (on flashing mode) or a helmet-mounted light that you can flash to the side. Assuming you are moving, it's the light shone at 20-45 degrees that counts (not directly side on) - the Orbit wastes most of the little light it has in directions that don't matter.

The rotating motion might be of value in attracting attention if the Orbit were bright enough to stand out against much brighter light sources. The flashing mode found on most bike lights serves a similar purpose.
Flashing front lights at night suck.
There is also a reason cars run side markers its so they can be seen at night side on. They aren't all that bright, but make a huge difference.


Flashing lights work though. No need to be obnoxious with sure-high power - as much illuminance as a car light is probably enough.
As far as side markers go, you could say 'There is also a reason they aren't require on cars or motorbikes. They don't make a huge difference'.

Here's one of the concluding comments from a well thought out article on this topic:
"Recognise the risk of being in a saccade. High contrast clothing and lights help. In particular, flashing LED’s (front and rear) are especially effective for cyclists as they create contrast and the on-off flashing attracts the peripheral vision in the same manner that movement does."
http://www.londoncyclist.co.uk/raf-pilot-teach-cyclists/

Interesting article read something similar before. But with the basis of the article wouldn't a flashing light make it worse?
Depending on the flash rate etc... of the light you have about a 50% chance of them still not seeing you, its all good if it flashes while they are looking no good if it doesn't.

Cyclist in general would be better off obeying all the road rules, not riding like a twat or light them selves up like a sun. Rather than thinking because I have x number of lumens I'm instantly going to be good, take the they haven't seen me.
Drivers need to look for and be willing to wait for something smaller than them. And not so worried about losing 30seconds on there 20min drive.

That Topeak bottle cage is mint. Should be about $55 in NZ


The article recommends flashing lights as a way of attracting attention in peripheral vision - it assumes the real problem for cyclists is the high chance of being outside of a drivers narowly focused field of vision (where fixations occur). During the day, a driver should see a cyclist OK when the cyclist happens to be in one of these points of eye fixation (without the need for any light) but they might need some help to see a cyclists in the periphery - that's when a flashing light helps (or any type of movement).

During the night, we recommend a flashing and steady light, and the frequency of the flashing light is significant (light's standards have a specification for that to ensure the gap between bursts of light isn't too great).

Seems like your main objection might be to lights that are too bright. I agree they can be obnoxious (and the new ISO standards will specify a maxium illuminance).
Simonk
Member for: 14 years 3 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Orphan on Mon 1/Jun/15 7:53pm

I have to say I really want to see the use of over bright giga lumen lights stopped. Vehicles would fail a warrant immediately for blinding other road users, yet these self righteous (ok, only spoken nicely to two such 'cyclists' and they told me to have sexual relations elsewhere) yoiks think they're above this.

I was actually on my bike when I suggested they point their lights down.
Orphan
User avatar
"I ride bicycles."
Member for: 2 years 7 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Farm on Mon 1/Jun/15 8:26pm

Orphan wrote:I have to say I really want to see the use of over bright giga lumen lights stopped. Vehicles would fail a warrant immediately for blinding other road users, yet these self righteous (ok, only spoken nicely to two such 'cyclists' and they told me to have sexual relations elsewhere) yoiks think they're above this.

I was actually on my bike when I suggested they point their lights down.


Getting on the Internet to complain about self righteous yoiks and confronted 2 people in the street. Might want to have a little think about self righteousness.
Farm
User avatar
Member for: 11 years 5 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Orphan on Mon 1/Jun/15 10:07pm

Am not being self righteous at all. Stating facts. :-)

Sorry if you read it that way.
Orphan
User avatar
"I ride bicycles."
Member for: 2 years 7 months

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