Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Simonk on Sat 9/May/15 9:22am

danose wrote:
Simonk wrote:The Orbit output is pitiful. It didn't event register on our illuminometer (which only registers illuminance above 2.5 Lux). I think we removed it from our results because it's more like a Christmas decoration than a bike light. When riding in traffic, a bike light's gotta compete with car lights - about 600 Lux at 2 m.



well if you test it using the same methodology as a rear light that's a bit retarded. The orbit actually works well because it's flashing and rotating - which catches people's attention. Doesn't need to be super bright. I

think it's a moot point though as looking online it seems cat eye has discontinued them - hopefully they'll do something to replace it cos there's ZILCHO other options for side viz (well maybe a fibreflare type light the downtube)


I disagree. If you want something to attract the attention of drivers coming out of side-streets and driveways, you're better to rely on a bright front light with a wide beam (on flashing mode) or a helmet-mounted light that you can flash to the side. Assuming you are moving, it's the light shone at 20-45 degrees that counts (not directly side on) - the Orbit wastes most of the little light it has in directions that don't matter.

The rotating motion might be of value in attracting attention if the Orbit were bright enough to stand out against much brighter light sources. The flashing mode found on most bike lights serves a similar purpose.
Simonk
Member for: 14 years 3 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby happybaboon on Sat 9/May/15 4:20pm

I think a rotating, flashing light on the wheels could well be of benefit. Particularly if it's of a different colour (yellow)
More colours, more lights = good. But I agree they must be paired with a bright as buggery front light with excellent side visibility.
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Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby UK_Exile on Mon 11/May/15 8:52am

I disagree with the need bright & wide 45deg angle type comments. What urban commuters need to something different so that it gets noticed. The wheel lights & the likes of the fibre flare may not be bright but they get noticed & that is what is important
UK_Exile
Member for: 12 years 3 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Simonk on Mon 11/May/15 9:31am

UK_Exile wrote:I disagree with the need bright & wide 45deg angle type comments. What urban commuters need to something different so that it gets noticed. The wheel lights & the likes of the fibre flare may not be bright but they get noticed & that is what is important


The critical 'something different' for bike lights is flashing mode. If the light source isn't bright enough to attract attention in thick traffic from at least 50 m, the pattern of light is not really going to help. There's a good reason that motor vehicle lights specify a particular brightness on daytime running lights - they've established that illuminance matters when attracting attention.

There's a set of ISO bicycle lights standards being developed at the moment. Brightness across a wide beam in the key characteristic being defined (as it already is in the German and Japanese lights standards).

I think the Fibre Flare makes a good supplementary light (especially if you're looking for something to hang from a backpack or put on the back of a helmet) but it's a bit too dim to rely on as you primary light.
Simonk
Member for: 14 years 3 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby UK_Exile on Mon 11/May/15 10:14am

I'm using along fibre flare mounted on rear triangle as my side protection & a square 4 LED Knog as rear protection. Last winter had a fibre flare MVP too on helmet however since changed helmet & it doesn't fit easily. I really need to create a mount as it got a lot of positive comments from other cyclists for standing out. Guessing both height & shape was a factor in that
UK_Exile
Member for: 12 years 3 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Datsane on Mon 18/May/15 10:38pm

Simonk wrote:
danose wrote:
Simonk wrote:The Orbit output is pitiful. It didn't event register on our illuminometer (which only registers illuminance above 2.5 Lux). I think we removed it from our results because it's more like a Christmas decoration than a bike light. When riding in traffic, a bike light's gotta compete with car lights - about 600 Lux at 2 m.



well if you test it using the same methodology as a rear light that's a bit retarded. The orbit actually works well because it's flashing and rotating - which catches people's attention. Doesn't need to be super bright. I

think it's a moot point though as looking online it seems cat eye has discontinued them - hopefully they'll do something to replace it cos there's ZILCHO other options for side viz (well maybe a fibreflare type light the downtube)


I disagree. If you want something to attract the attention of drivers coming out of side-streets and driveways, you're better to rely on a bright front light with a wide beam (on flashing mode) or a helmet-mounted light that you can flash to the side. Assuming you are moving, it's the light shone at 20-45 degrees that counts (not directly side on) - the Orbit wastes most of the little light it has in directions that don't matter.

The rotating motion might be of value in attracting attention if the Orbit were bright enough to stand out against much brighter light sources. The flashing mode found on most bike lights serves a similar purpose.
Flashing front lights at night suck.
There is also a reason cars run side markers its so they can be seen at night side on. They aren't all that bright, but make a huge difference.
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Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby jimmi71 on Tue 19/May/15 6:47am

Im not a fan of ultra bright flashing front lights. They seem dangerous and offensive to other road users. Ive posted this before, but my MTB night light on solid beam pointing in front of my bike (not up at other road users) is fantastic. I can actually see the road in front of me and its really safe for riding in traffic, mostly due to what I think is motorists mistaking me for a motorbike or scooter. I also use an altura night vision vest, ankle reflectors, cherry bomb rear light and some other reflectors around my saddle bag.
jimmi71
Member for: 2 years 6 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Simonk on Tue 19/May/15 9:44am

Datsane wrote:
Simonk wrote:
danose wrote:
Simonk wrote:The Orbit output is pitiful. It didn't event register on our illuminometer (which only registers illuminance above 2.5 Lux). I think we removed it from our results because it's more like a Christmas decoration than a bike light. When riding in traffic, a bike light's gotta compete with car lights - about 600 Lux at 2 m.



well if you test it using the same methodology as a rear light that's a bit retarded. The orbit actually works well because it's flashing and rotating - which catches people's attention. Doesn't need to be super bright. I

think it's a moot point though as looking online it seems cat eye has discontinued them - hopefully they'll do something to replace it cos there's ZILCHO other options for side viz (well maybe a fibreflare type light the downtube)


I disagree. If you want something to attract the attention of drivers coming out of side-streets and driveways, you're better to rely on a bright front light with a wide beam (on flashing mode) or a helmet-mounted light that you can flash to the side. Assuming you are moving, it's the light shone at 20-45 degrees that counts (not directly side on) - the Orbit wastes most of the little light it has in directions that don't matter.

The rotating motion might be of value in attracting attention if the Orbit were bright enough to stand out against much brighter light sources. The flashing mode found on most bike lights serves a similar purpose.
Flashing front lights at night suck.
There is also a reason cars run side markers its so they can be seen at night side on. They aren't all that bright, but make a huge difference.


Flashing lights work though. No need to be obnoxious with sure-high power - as much illuminance as a car light is probably enough.
As far as side markers go, you could say 'There is also a reason they aren't require on cars or motorbikes. They don't make a huge difference'.

Here's one of the concluding comments from a well thought out article on this topic:
"Recognise the risk of being in a saccade. High contrast clothing and lights help. In particular, flashing LED’s (front and rear) are especially effective for cyclists as they create contrast and the on-off flashing attracts the peripheral vision in the same manner that movement does."
http://www.londoncyclist.co.uk/raf-pilot-teach-cyclists/
Simonk
Member for: 14 years 3 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby UK_Exile on Wed 20/May/15 12:40pm

Something different. Possibly useful as additional protection
http://gearjunkie.com/bike-water-bottle-cage-light
UK_Exile
Member for: 12 years 3 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Cruzzer on Wed 20/May/15 4:45pm

I thought that the Life Paint from Volvo was a great idea until I read that it only lasts a week and washes off in water, doh!
But wow, it certainly polarised a bunch of people...

http://road.cc/content/news/147529-volvo-life-paint-comes-under-fire-while-freebies-fly-shelves
Cruzzer
Member for: 9 years 4 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby happybaboon on Wed 20/May/15 4:51pm

Hmmm... OK I just had an idea.... Install COB bar LED's all over teh frame.
Yellow down the sides of the top and down tubes and chainstays, red down the backs of the seatstays, white down the forks...
Wire it all into one battery pack through one plug for easy removal/charging and maybe a module to make all of the suckers flash.

Thoughts?
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Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby happybaboon on Wed 20/May/15 5:01pm

Oh man I am totally doing this :D
You can get 12v strobe flash controllers as a unit for $6.50 on aliexpress.
The LED's will run like $30 or $40 bucks.........
happybaboon
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Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby UK_Exile on Wed 20/May/15 5:20pm

Just wrap some xmas tree lights around frame :p
Get solar charging ones & be a super greenie :thumbsup: (if you ignore what happens to the batteries once dead....)
UK_Exile
Member for: 12 years 3 months

Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby Simonius_Titius on Wed 20/May/15 7:46pm

UK_Exile wrote:Something different. Possibly useful as additional protection
http://gearjunkie.com/bike-water-bottle-cage-light

That's a nice novelty. History shows that integrating a function which could easily be separated is not the way to go though. Why not a separate bottle illuminator that uses the standard bidon mounts and illuminates the bottle from underneath, or from either side.

But hang on, what about when you want to head out at night without needing water, without wanting your bottle exposed to theft by drunks, and possibly not wanting the weight and wind resistance of a full bottle anyway? An empty clear (i.e. cheap) bottle is no good, the light will just go straight up and blind the rider.

I know, let's just have the LEDs pointing sideways with a tiny diffuser to get good coverage. And a hood so they don't annoy the rider especially when they have glasses with water droplets on them. No bottle needed. And they can be mounted in seconds by wrapping a stretchy thing onto a hook, and placed where they don't get obstructed, on the downtube or top tube. Something like a Knog frog.
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Re: Commuter Bike Lights

Postby happybaboon on Wed 20/May/15 9:53pm

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of integrated bike lights in a frame. You could have a battery that can be charged by solar power, dynamo, plug-in, disposable battery..... Or everything. How cool would that be?
happybaboon
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Member for: 15 years 8 months

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