Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby Al_Bushman on Sat 11/Jun/11 9:55pm

I wasn't too impressed at the antics of a young rider in C in one of the sprints. He was giving it some elbow and massaging his helmet into my shoulder. I'm used to it in the higher grades, but I saw him do it to someone else who may not have had the experience to cope.

I didn't realise a bunch of C graders came down though? I wondered what had happened to everybody. I remember passing E grade but when I did I was at the front of C and didn't hear a thing.

Another reason to stay at the pointy end or jump up a grade.
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby Fergie on Sat 11/Jun/11 10:10pm

Did you get a number or recall the bike or jersey. A Commissaire can not take action unless we see it ourselves but we can make it pretty clear to that rider that they are on our s**t list and will be watched very closely. That is my concern for next week is that it is unlicensed racing so that "riders compete at their own risk" message takes on a whole new meaning.

The big crash was in D grade but a C grade rider did crash.
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby DerrickN on Sat 11/Jun/11 10:52pm

This is not the forum for airing concerns over the perceived actions of any riders in an event. These must only be taken up with the event organisers at the time who will investigate and take any appropriate action. There are formal and recognised avenues to air concerns, and the public domain is not one of them.
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby Fergie on Sat 11/Jun/11 11:18pm

Event organisers? What can they do? It is the role of the Commissaire to manage the conduct of the event and apply sanctions. Perhaps the lack of a Commissaire (I was out there training and coaching) today was a contributing factor in the poor standard of riding. Getting tough at Schools Racing has led to a far higher standard of riding.

I am not expecting a public name and shame but I don't care what forum is used as long as the message gets out to people to ride with their safety, the safety of others and the safety of the sport (unless we want to have to hire Ruapuna every weekend).
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby gydey on Sun 12/Jun/11 8:30am

Everyone is getting too OTT!! Crashes happen be it a club race or the Tour de France.. have 2 wheels, will fall off!! I rode C Grade and all in all it was an aggressive well behaved race (except when B Grade were caught and wouldnt back off) and in the ensuing sprint, Mr C Grade sprint King just flicked from one side of the road to the other, hit another rider whos foot came out and hit my handlebar forcing me off the road. A less experienced rider would have crashed! The crash in C Grade was on the last lap just after you took off Al. It happened right behind me, on a straight piece of road when the bunch was going reasonably quick at a high tempo. So there was no swerving , or stop/starting, is was purely innattention on the riders behalf and his fault! Your comment Derrick re giving space doesnt sit with me sorry. We are here to race and we ride close and follow wheels close, rub shoulders as just part of racing. It is the responsibility of those novice riders to get skilled up appropriately to cope with race conditions by going out with bunches in training rides, or if they arent confident, sit at the back until they can ride in a race situation. I also definitely dont think the bunches are too big! Its a massed start race..not a 10 up group handicap. Hamish and I have spoken many times about the new riders coming into the sport, which is fantastic, however they have no idea of rider ettiquette in terms of contributing in a race, how to lap in different wind directions etc. Even B Grade often lap the wrong way which is a sad indictment of the fact that we as a sport dont offer a coaching evening, to go over the basic principles, etiquette and race savvy for the new riders and they are left to fend for themselves and often learn the wrong things as opposed to the right things.

I am more than happy to contribute my time to a talk, take a training session or whatever to help the new riders ( and some of the not so new riders who have learnt the wrong things). We had this discussion at the end of last years Winter Series but nothing came of it.

So in a nutshell, races are races. Crashes will happen, and riders need to upskill to reduce the risk of crashes. Many are caused by riders inattention, or doing something they shouldnt within a bunch situation. IMO education will easily help remedy this as opposed to threats of sanctions, or some of the other options offered on this thread!!

Terry Gyde
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www.cyclecoaching.co.nz
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby Fergie on Sun 12/Jun/11 12:40pm

Well said Terry. As a Commissaire giving race briefings I go beyond the rules and give instruction on safe riding. This is not covered in rules or any Commisssire course I have sat. A good race is where I can congratulate the riders for their conduct at the end.
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby great uncle bulgaria on Sun 12/Jun/11 2:14pm

D grade crash was an experience thing i understand. 2 riders went down. straight line riding. ist to go down, i understand, was overlapping the rear wheel of the bike in front and about 10 cm from it . . . . . it was just a matter of time i understand.

What was that Gydey was saying about skills and etiquette coaching . . . . . ? I'd be keen to learn/help.
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby Al_Bushman on Sun 12/Jun/11 9:39pm

DerrickN wrote:This is not the forum for airing concerns over the perceived actions of any riders in an event. These must only be taken up with the event organisers at the time who will investigate and take any appropriate action. There are formal and recognised avenues to air concerns, and the public domain is not one of them.


I took it upon myself to have a wee word with the young fella immediately after the initial incidents (in a nice way). He'd come from a junior track racing meet (probably Ferg's) so was full of adolescent trackie confidence. I was glued to his wheel in all the other sprints (apart from the time I kicked his arse :p ) and he didn't do it again, although he could possibly have been the one to swerve as he followed my sprint in one of the primes.

As far as I'm concerned, from that one incident onwards he rode a good race. I know his number, and his name but I will not name him. He just needed to show us oldies some RESPECT ha ha. :lol:

If I have major issues with someone I'd respect Derrick's comments above and follow club rules, after all we sign and agree to them at the start of the race. Having said that there's nothing wrong with the more experienced guys acting as bunch police and having words with people who misbehave during a race. If anything it's much better than not doing anything at all. If they continue the behaviour which results in a crash then take it up with the organisers.
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby Al_Bushman on Mon 13/Jun/11 8:51am

PS - The guy wasn't one of Ferg's - I was just baiting. ;)
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby rochie on Mon 13/Jun/11 9:52am

Al you devil :satan: !!
B grade was a small select group due to a few DNS's and several of our usual members featuring in C grade ... We started out pretty slow (why hurry?) a few attacks, followed by a good sprint at the first prime. My dreams of glory shattered when I found somebody had replaced my muscles with wet sand. Then George punctured. C grade caught us while we were doing track-stands up on the banking, and everything got muxed up. I couldn't really tell who was in my race. Tried to get off the front but they chased me. So we decided to drop out the back and continue our highly tactical race. Then I punctured. Figured I might as well see out my laps since I had a few points on the board for the series and DNF isn't in my play-book. Rode with Rog for a bit. That's it really. Didn't occur to me that I could skip a lap and re-enter the B grade race. Bit pointless though because I couldn't figure where it was. Well done to the marshals and their lollipop signs.
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby pantani1 on Mon 13/Jun/11 9:40pm

I agree with you there Al , the young guys just need a word in the ear until they learn the rules.Its great to have these younger guys comming through, sometimes i do see older guys going off at them which is not generally needed, i have found they normally learn pretty quick.Its sometimes the same older guys(luckily theres not many of them) who are more of a problem, often the same ones that sit on the back all day too!
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby SharkyR on Tue 14/Jun/11 10:29am

Hey Al was that you with the kelford vest on?

I remember someone yelling about how we don't lean in the lower grades. The reason I leaned on you if it was me was because there was someone on the otherside of me moving across the same as were you trying to get the wheel I was on and I had nowhere to go so appologies but that is racing.

I agree with Terry's post in the fact that the crash was caused by rider inattention. C grade was all over the road as people on the front were swinging left and right this was only made worse when we caught B grade.
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby Al_Bushman on Tue 14/Jun/11 1:58pm

SharkyR wrote:Hey Al was that you with the kelford vest on?

I remember someone yelling about how we don't lean in the lower grades. The reason I leaned on you if it was me was because there was someone on the otherside of me moving across the same as were you trying to get the wheel I was on and I had nowhere to go so appologies but that is racing.

I agree with Terry's post in the fact that the crash was caused by rider inattention. C grade was all over the road as people on the front were swinging left and right this was only made worse when we caught B grade.


Twas me in the Kelford vest and yes I did comment to you that that kind of behaviour was unacceptable in that grade. Yes it is racing, however in the same sprint another rider you pushed out of the way also commented that he wasn't impressed either and felt you were riding dangerously.

Overall I felt C grade was fine and had no other issues in the race. Didn't notice any trouble when we caught B grade either. I also felt you rode a good race too - just that one incident I felt you may have been a bit over enthusiastic - but you got the win so I guess that's mud in my eye! :p
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby Al_Bushman on Tue 14/Jun/11 2:17pm

PS - were you a DNF? I was looking for you in the results sheet as I expected you to win the bunch kick. I was too busy retching on the side of the road to watch. :blink:
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Re: Christchurch Summer Season

Postby SharkyR on Tue 14/Jun/11 2:42pm

Punctured last lap on that loose shingle section which was a bit of a bummer
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