Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby Oli on Thu 9/Apr/09 9:00am

Although a cycleway that can easily be used by roadies is more versatile, hence more economically viable and justifiable. Perhaps it could be a bit of both? Roadies certainly wouldn't mind a traffic-free route between the main centres - avoiding vehicles might make riding more sociable - and also you could link up the many awesome MTB areas if the network was cleverly routed.

Perhaps if you had a corridor already carved it mightn't take much to run an off-road trail parallel to the hotmix anyway?
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby tylersdad on Thu 9/Apr/09 9:30am

Oli wrote:Perhaps if you had a corridor already carved it mightn't take much to run an off-road trail parallel to the hotmix anyway?


i thought of this too, but then the gravel gets flicked up onto the hotmix, and its not regularly swept, and then the roadies get upset, ..........................and thats when the fight started....again....


imagine the cost of sending a little sweeper machine down the cycleway. the driver will need to take his sleeping bag with him. And so much for scenic, peace and quiet, OSH rules will mean he needs big whoop whoop lights and sirens so cyclists don't crash into him. not to mention the need to employ someone to put up warning cones and signs -the visual pollution.

would the construction cost be kept down by using chain gangs? they are sitting in prisons on thier arses doing nothing, so this is actually allowing the taxpayer to get a return on thier money????? indeed, we could use the same people to sweep the cycleway once its up and running.

essentially the costs are thus - labour - zip, gravel or hotmix $50m.

we could even use the prison labour to extract the gravel.


and now i wait for the PC brigade to shoot me down............
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby Simonk on Sat 11/Apr/09 2:37pm

In response to Mono's question - there's about 95,000 km of road in NZ. About a third of that is unsealed.

With regards to sealed vs unsealed cycle paths - there's bound to be a mix involved, although I do wonder if the Central Otago Rail Trail would be as popular if it was sealed? Certainly the cost-benefit-ratio would take a hit (I'd have thought).

The point about bikes needing to be able to withstand some loose gravel (regardless of whether or not the track is sealed) is a good one. I reckon it makes sense for the bulk of the cycle path to be designed with 'hybrids' or touring bikes in mind.
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby groklem on Mon 4/Jan/10 9:05am

Does anyone know if there are plans afoot to produce a map of this National Cycleway?

The tourism web site has some maps but they in pdfs so not really useable. (http://tourism.govt.nz/Our-Work/New-Zea ... rt-Tracks/)

In the UK their national cycleway is on opencyclemap.org (more info here http://www.gravitystorm.co.uk/shine/cycle-info/)

Seeing as the opencyclemap and openstreetmap projects are international efforts wouldn't it make sense to put the New Zealand National Cycleway on opencyclemap?

Linz is already an active contributer to the openstreet map project. (http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/LINZ_Trial_Import) so opencyclemap would seem a good place to put info on the National Cycleway.
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby jimmi on Mon 11/Jan/10 9:56am

I guess this is the best area for updates on the National Cycleway. Just noticed this article on the nzherald website. It covers info on Great Barriers submission to be part of the cycleway, and a bit on Aucklands 12 submissions.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/artic ... d=10619464
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby Kevin Hague on Mon 11/Jan/10 11:14am

groklem wrote:Does anyone know if there are plans afoot to produce a map of this National Cycleway?


I don't know that "a map" will be produced, but certainly maps will be (although electronic versions kind of render the difference unimportant). The network will evolve over time, so to begin with the rides that are created (and exisiting rides that are incorporated into the project) will tend to be more like individual tracks, unconnected with each other. As time progresses the tracks will gradually link up, until the network exists. This probably also lends itself to an electronic mapping system, as paper maps will quite quickly become our of date. That said, I'm still a fan of paper maps, and used them on the National Cycle Network in Britain. The maps specifically produced by Sustrans had lots of detail about the designated track or route, but very little off-route. This made them great provided you didn't want to explore further afield, or go and do shopping or something. I remember a dreadful day in pouring rain navigating through Bristol, where we lost the path entering the city and didn't refind it until we hit the bridge over into Wales (think heavy industry and heavy traffic).

Also important will be the development of standard signage, and there's a team working on that.

There are some great proposals that have been submitted for this next stage, but I'd better check that they can be made public before I publish any of them. Congratulations to Vorbi who were involved in getting together local proposals. It really shows when a proposal has good cyclist input.
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby groklem on Tue 12/Jan/10 12:56pm

Cool, Its great to hear that NZ Tourism are thinking about the mapping side of things.

I don't know that "a map" will be produced, but certainly maps will be (although electronic versions kind of render the difference unimportant)


I think my point is: Seeing as a platform already exists for publishing the route of a national cycleway. Duplication of effort creating a "special" nz only map wouldn't be as efficient as leveraging the work already done by the openstreetmap / opencyclemap projects.

As time progresses the tracks will gradually link up, until the network exists. This probably also lends itself to an electronic mapping system, as paper maps will quite quickly become our of date.


I agree that electronic maps are preferable to paper-only maps. Usually conversion to paper versions is easy ("print") and increasingly more people carry phones with internet access.

The maps specifically produced by Sustrans had lots of detail about the designated track or route, but very little off-route


... and thats where electronic maps excel, in providing contextual information. You can overlay the route on top of satellite photos, street maps etc.

...and its the drawback of the current information being published to PDF. The information can't be easily reused/remixed.
LINZ seem to be pretty forward thinking, they are publishing govt mapping data under the Creative Commons license (check out http://koordinates.com/) allowing people to re-purpose the data.

The other advantage of an online, browseable, user contributable map is photos video and rich content. For example: http://tracks.org.nz/area/show/5 (helmet cam youtube video of ride on Mt. Vic) This is what tourists look for when they research their holidays.
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby iodi on Tue 12/Jan/10 1:53pm

We could, of course, add the New Zealand Cycle Trail Project to http://www.tracks.org.nz

For example Bridge to Nowhere, which it is planned will become part of the project.
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby Kevin Hague on Tue 12/Jan/10 3:08pm

Thanks. Great suggestions, which I will certainly feed into the mix. Will also need to link into things like Simon's Wellington route planner, as the urban interfaces are going to be very important.
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby groklem on Tue 12/Jan/10 3:09pm

We could, of course, add the New Zealand Cycle Trail Project to http://www.tracks.org.nz


heh! I am glad you bought that up. :)

For example Bridge to Nowhere, which it is planned will become part of the project.


I noticed Bridge to Nowhere had been added as part of the project. I did that ride as a "there and back" was quite tough going.
I didn't realise it had been added to tracks.org.nz! (adding some photos from my trip to the page now)

Seems tracks.org.nz is really picking up some momentum, lots of people adding to it over summer months I guess.
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby iodi on Tue 12/Jan/10 3:32pm

groklem wrote:Seems tracks.org.nz is really picking up some momentum, lots of people adding to it over summer months I guess.

Certainly is. http://www.tracks.org.nz now has descriptions and maps etc for 2170km of tracks around the country, with more being added almost every day. I'm sure there's room for the New Zealand Cycle Trail Project tracks too - just needs people to add the tracks in their local area.
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby groklem on Tue 12/Jan/10 5:30pm

Certainly is. http://www.tracks.org.nz now has descriptions and maps etc for 2170km of tracks around the country, with more being added almost every day.


Wow thats pretty impressive.

I added an elevation chart for the Bridge to Nowhere ride.

In lieu of tracks.org.nz getting its own elevation charts, you can create elevation charts here:
http://www.gamma.net.nz/node/add/elevation-chart

Just attach the kml file, put the name of file in the "track" box and it will create an elevation chart.

Getting a bit off topic here... perhaps we need a tracks.org.nz thread?
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby iodi on Tue 12/Jan/10 10:37pm

groklem wrote:In lieu of tracks.org.nz getting its own elevation charts, you can create elevation charts here:
http://www.gamma.net.nz/node/add/elevation-chart

Nice. I'm certainly keen to add elevation charts to http://www.tracks.org.nz We have all the parts - just need to put them together...
groklem wrote:Getting a bit off topic here... perhaps we need a tracks.org.nz thread?

Good idea.
Edit: And so it came to pass All Things Tracks.org.nz
Last edited by iodi on Thu 11/Feb/10 9:41pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby BrokenKonaRider on Thu 11/Feb/10 8:59pm

Sorry if this old news:

"Thirteen cycle trails nationwide are a step closer to becoming part of the national cycleway.

New Zealand cycle trail programme manager John Dunn said the 13 had been selected from 54 to proceed to feasibility study stage.

All applications were outstanding but, with only $50 million to work with, only those that were "simply superior in every way" had been selected for the next stage," Mr Dunn said.

"These applications promise trails of stunning beauty and, along with the previously announced Quick Start projects, will provide a network of about 2000km of iconic great rides," he said.

They are: Tauranga Moana Coastal Cycle Trail (Tauranga); Old Motu Coach Road (Opotiki Gisborne); Thermal by Bike (Rotorua); Lake Track (Taupo); Mountains to Sea Cycleway - link (Ruapehu); Heretaunga Ararua: Land of a Hundred Pathways (Hawke's Bay); Dun Mountain and Tasman Cycle Loop (Nelson Tasman); Old Ghost Road (West Coast); Westland Wilderness Trail (Greymouth); Alps to Ocean Cycle Trail (Mt Cook); The Wakatipu Trail (Queenstown); Roxburgh Gorge Trail (Central Otago); Clutha Gold Trail (Otago)."

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/artic ... d=10625547
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Re: Bikenz: National Cycleway – Like Winning Lotto For Cyclists

Postby skint on Fri 12/Feb/10 11:36am

So that's two projects in Bill English's electorate?
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