Astrid Anderson found guilty: Ramifications?

Postby E Dogg Capizzle on Sat 9/Aug/03 6:10pm

Anderson has been found guilty of criminal nuisance in the case pertaining to Le Race. What ramifications might this have for event organisation in terms of mountain biking? Thoughts please.
E Dogg Capizzle
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Postby GWSharky on Sat 9/Aug/03 6:18pm

Is that the race where that lady got killed by hitting car head on??

If it is road should have been closed..
Will end up putting more pressure on the event organisation and they will think twice before taking on that role for racing.
GWSharky
Member for: 14 years 6 months

Postby dirtmuncher on Sat 9/Aug/03 6:39pm

yes i was just watching the news and i think it is perfectly justifiable that astrid anderson should suffer the full legal consequence of his/her actions in organising the race, he/she should have,
a. sussed the legal stuff pertaining to the road rules
b. explained it to the fucking racers :hmmm:
it should/will defiitely make thorough explainations of the road rules, details of road closures etc etc etc mandatory
not so sure of the effect it will have on mtb events, hopefully markings of drops, jumps, loose soil, gravel etc etc etc would be instituted to minimise risk, but then again, thats what seperates different forms of bikers, which i will not get into for fear of flamage.
dirtmuncher
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Postby Scotty on Sun 10/Aug/03 10:01am

Well fellas, let's put it this way. I'm VERY carefully contemplating pulling ANY plans to organise any more downhill races after this ruling.

I don't wanna end up fucked if one of my assistants forgets to cover up a sharp stick on the side of the trail and someone messes themselves up.

Maybe you could say it's a bit over-cautious, but I ain't running the risk, and there's a lot out there like me. :hmmm:

It's just not worth doing it anymore :(
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Postby spg on Sun 10/Aug/03 12:06pm

I am guessing the standard "hurt yourself and its not our fault" disclaimers don't stand up in court? Cos all they have to do is say you were negligent in not covering that stick...
I would have thought Cycling NZ would have a standard format for road racing etc, that they believe will stand up in court, which people would run their events by.
spg
Member for: 15 years 0 months

Postby Tama on Sun 10/Aug/03 12:28pm

faceplant wrote:Well fellas, let's put it this way. I'm VERY carefully contemplating pulling ANY plans to organise any more downhill races after this ruling.

Agreed - after having my hand in 35+ events over the past years I can tell your three important things about organising MTB events:
* You make no money
* You lose part of your sanity
* You do it for love of the sport

I'm not putting my life on the line because people take risks in competitive situations - a piece of well known common-sense which seems to have been forgotten by a whole bunch of people in Christchurch.

It's a tragedy that Vanessa Caldwell died, but prosecuting Astrid Anderson will not bring her back, it will just mean there are less people who are willing to put their time and sanity into running events.
Tama
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Postby E Dogg Capizzle on Sun 10/Aug/03 1:36pm

Tama wrote:* You lose part of your sanity


I'm organising a couple this summer, should I book a spot in the "clinic" beforehand?
E Dogg Capizzle
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Postby michael on Sun 10/Aug/03 2:47pm

i think it means orginisers will have to take more care, because its now been very publisized (sp?) that disclaimers dont matter
michael
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Postby barracuda_butcher on Sun 10/Aug/03 5:01pm

Evil Dr Capek wrote:
Tama wrote:* You lose part of your sanity


I'm organising a couple this summer, should I book a spot in the "clinic" beforehand?

a weekend trip to [insert mtb park name here] afterwards should put back on the road to recovery. whether this is more/less sane is up to you :p
barracuda_butcher
Member for: 14 years 8 months

Postby Spacemonkey on Sun 10/Aug/03 9:31pm

Evil Dr Capek wrote:
Tama wrote:* You lose part of your sanity


I'm organising a couple this summer, should I book a spot in the "clinic" beforehand?


Well it's worrying me a bit "O" evil Doc of the southern sheep shaging "Poly" :hmmm:

I'll start arangeing my alibis/your doctors couch in the morning. :thumbsup: ....sssalright my big bro's a psyc Doc he'll look after ya

It apears to me that Ingrid Anderson got done because she misslead the
competitors into thinking that the summit road was closed.....which apears to have been no more than a ruse to keep out unentered riders from the road.
a home video of the prestart anouncement's showed her Stating that the
summit road was a closed road. :eh:
It was that bit that caused all the kerfufle.....on a side note if a road IS
closed are you still bound by the Road code? :eh:
or are those laws suspended for the duration of the event? :eh:
Spacemonkey
Member for: 15 years 7 months

Postby jeremyb on Mon 11/Aug/03 8:45am

I think it's retarded and pathetic that someone is made a scapegoat in this, it had to happen eventually tho', everything else in this country gets legislated against, dogs, car exhausts...

There needs to be a court case that makes the disclaimer you file a 100% legally binding document that you give away all your rights if you choose to participate and have an accident.

She still has a chance to appeal, hopefully it'll get turned over, for the sake of all New Zealanders.
jeremyb
"www.derailled.co.nz - New Zealand Cycling Forum"
Member for: 14 years 11 months

Postby XCgeek on Mon 11/Aug/03 9:28am

The disclaimer does not mean anything is this case because it was the police that brought the charges forward and they never signed anything. As an event organizor, I don't think the ruling will effect many mountain bike events. There maybe some problem for events such and the Karapoti and Mt Peel as both of these events do use public roads. There could also be problems getting councel land access as most of the people that run councels are old and do not understand the joy of mountain biking.

Astrids biggest problem is that she said the road was closed when it was not.
XCgeek
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Postby Tama on Mon 11/Aug/03 10:33am

Spacemonkey wrote:It apears to me that Ingrid Anderson got done because she misslead the competitors into thinking that the summit road was closed.....which apears to have been no more than a ruse to keep out unentered riders from the road.
a home video of the prestart anouncement's showed her Stating that the
summit road was a closed road. :eh:

Oh - shows how much I know... That's a pretty fucking stupid thing to do.
Tama
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Postby LongDrop on Mon 11/Aug/03 11:20am

Even if the road were closed there would still have been support vehicles and possibly emergency vehicles on it. That would surely have been obvious.
LongDrop
Member for: 14 years 5 months

Postby ben on Mon 11/Aug/03 11:24am

jeremyb wrote:There needs to be a court case that makes the disclaimer you file a 100% legally binding document that you give away all your rights if you choose to participate and have an accident.



That would be a MAGIC disclaimer.

And most likely illeagal.

Some rights you can't sign away, like for instance you can't conract out of the consumer gaurnetees act. Even if you have a MAGIC disclaimer, you still expect there be some compedncy of of the people who you singed it with.

If someone dies at event that you have organised, its fairly reasonable the the event comes under some scrutiny. While I personally feel that they have been harsh on the organiser of the "le Race", I don't know all the details. I don't think that anyone here would run an event where they thought there was a high likely hood of killing some one.
ben
Member for: 14 years 9 months

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