Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby onyabike on Mon 5/Sep/11 3:09pm

wuffy wrote:


fckn pinner - what a run!
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Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby wuffy on Mon 5/Sep/11 3:10pm

Sam Hill Protege
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Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby banga on Mon 5/Sep/11 3:33pm

cruiser wrote::crazy: :crazy: :thumbsup:


banga wrote:
onyabike wrote:remind me why it's called freecaster

Do some research, freecaster have provided amazing footage all year for
Free. It's not their fault the uci are scum bags looking to line their pockets.

setting aside the shit governance of UCI by fat white guys, how would you suggest UCI fund and progress MTB better?

another question: If you created a premium product, would you give it away - whether freecaster or UCI?


The thing is that the UCI has done very little (if anything) to "create" the product, in my (and other people's) opinion the product has been created by the likes of Freecaster, vitalmtb and dirt tv among others who put out consistently amazing footage every world cup that brings the racing to the world, creates the hype/buzz.

Then you get the UCI coming in and demanding ridiculous amounts (rumours of €8000 from dirttv)to film for the weekend of the world champs and banning other outlets. And reportedly demanding €100,000 from freecaster for the "rights" to broadcast the next world cup season.

This is why the UCI are scumbags. Don't even get me started on the rocky road fiasco.
There is talk of a rival global series which would work for dh as it's not an Olympic sport.
I would quite happily pay a reasonable fee ($50?) to watch a season of world cup action.
banga
Member for: 14 years 7 months

Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby benw on Mon 5/Sep/11 4:57pm

banga wrote:
cruiser wrote::crazy: :crazy: :thumbsup:


banga wrote:
onyabike wrote:remind me why it's called freecaster

Do some research, freecaster have provided amazing footage all year for
Free. It's not their fault the uci are scum bags looking to line their pockets.

setting aside the shit governance of UCI by fat white guys, how would you suggest UCI fund and progress MTB better?

another question: If you created a premium product, would you give it away - whether freecaster or UCI?


The thing is that the UCI has done very little (if anything) to "create" the product, in my (and other people's) opinion the product has been created by the likes of Freecaster, vitalmtb and dirt tv among others who put out consistently amazing footage every world cup that brings the racing to the world, creates the hype/buzz.

Then you get the UCI coming in and demanding ridiculous amounts (rumours of €8000 from dirttv)to film for the weekend of the world champs and banning other outlets. And reportedly demanding €100,000 from freecaster for the "rights" to broadcast the next world cup season.

This is why the UCI are scumbags. Don't even get me started on the rocky road fiasco.
There is talk of a rival global series which would work for dh as it's not an Olympic sport.
I would quite happily pay a reasonable fee ($50?) to watch a season of world cup action.

€100,000 for the season would be NOTHING if even half the people who spend thousands of $$$$ every year on their bikes forked over for the measly $25 NZD bucks to watch the finals. I was happy to pay that as I felt it was supporting the full season's worth of generally great coverage, didn't even watch it live, the replay, actually Danny Hart's run alone, made it worth while (and the bastard pirates are already posting shitty copies of that run on the internet which just screws Freecaster more, jerks).

So I'd even say that if you enjoyed the broadcast last night, maybe it was at a mates house, why not buy the ticket after the fact to say 'cheers boys' for a great season of FREEcasting and help make sure it happens again next year. Bottom line is that if we don't support Freecaster who have been doing a great job (despite it being bloody difficult - predicting the internet load must be bloody difficult for these events so no surprise sometimes they get caught out) then we won't have jack shit next year or we'll have some god-awful coverage and crap coverage when Rocky Roads picks that up too, and that might be the best case scenario.

By the way, I am not even sure €8,000 is that bad given the eyeballs that DirtTV gets from an event like this, maybe they need a better advertising base or some such as people from around the world were gagging for coverage. One of the big brands like SRAM could fund that, guys who easily spend that much tricking out those big trucks. Yes the UCI are a pain in the ass but no one else is putting up their hands to run this event at this point and it's a thankless task.
benw
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Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby Wobbler on Mon 5/Sep/11 5:11pm

Given how shithouse the freecaster feed is sometimes I for one am glad for the bastard pirates
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Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby benw on Mon 5/Sep/11 5:26pm

Wobbler wrote:Given how shithouse the freecaster feed is sometimes I for one am glad for the bastard pirates

Any idea how hard it is to setup a free internet video streaming service to handle any number of concurrent feeds?

Still I guess you'd be happy with nothing, and nothing for the pirates to post either in that case...
benw
Member for: 12 years 0 months

Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby banga on Mon 5/Sep/11 5:28pm

benw wrote:
banga wrote:
cruiser wrote::crazy: :crazy: :thumbsup:


banga wrote:
onyabike wrote:remind me why it's called freecaster

Do some research, freecaster have provided amazing footage all year for
Free. It's not their fault the uci are scum bags looking to line their pockets.

setting aside the shit governance of UCI by fat white guys, how would you suggest UCI fund and progress MTB better?

another question: If you created a premium product, would you give it away - whether freecaster or UCI?


The thing is that the UCI has done very little (if anything) to "create" the product, in my (and other people's) opinion the product has been created by the likes of Freecaster, vitalmtb and dirt tv among others who put out consistently amazing footage every world cup that brings the racing to the world, creates the hype/buzz.

Then you get the UCI coming in and demanding ridiculous amounts (rumours of €8000 from dirttv)to film for the weekend of the world champs and banning other outlets. And reportedly demanding €100,000 from freecaster for the "rights" to broadcast the next world cup season.

This is why the UCI are scumbags. Don't even get me started on the rocky road fiasco.
There is talk of a rival global series which would work for dh as it's not an Olympic sport.
I would quite happily pay a reasonable fee ($50?) to watch a season of world cup action.

€100,000 for the season would be NOTHING if even half the people who spend thousands of $$$$ every year on their bikes forked over for the measly $25 NZD bucks to watch the finals. I was happy to pay that as I felt it was supporting the full season's worth of generally great coverage, didn't even watch it live, the replay, actually Danny Hart's run alone, made it worth while (and the bastard pirates are already posting shitty copies of that run on the internet which just screws Freecaster more, jerks).

So I'd even say that if you enjoyed the broadcast last night, maybe it was at a mates house, why not buy the ticket after the fact to say 'cheers boys' for a great season of FREEcasting and help make sure it happens again next year. Bottom line is that if we don't support Freecaster who have been doing a great job (despite it being bloody difficult - predicting the internet load must be bloody difficult for these events so no surprise sometimes they get caught out) then we won't have jack shit next year or we'll have some god-awful coverage and crap coverage when Rocky Roads picks that up too, and that might be the best case scenario.

By the way, I am not even sure €8,000 is that bad given the eyeballs that DirtTV gets from an event like this, maybe they need a better advertising base or some such as people from around the world were gagging for coverage. One of the big brands like SRAM could fund that, guys who easily spend that much tricking out those big trucks. Yes the UCI are a pain in the ass but no one else is putting up their hands to run this event at this point and it's a thankless task.


Maybe I wasn't very clear.
I and the majority of others don't have a problem with Freecaster. They are able to offer the footage for free because of large companies i.e your Scotts/Treks/Specializeds provide funding for the coverage. Which is fantastic for the sport and how it will grow.

The problem is when the UCI exploit the success that Freecaster has worked hard for, by picking an arbitrary number and saying you can't film/stream at world cups unless you stump up $xxx at the beginning of the season. And the UCI being the UCI if Freecaster stumps up this year they will no doubt charge double next year. Eur8000 allowed you to produce 5mins of footage...

FFS the marketing manager for the UCI lives 20 minutes from Champery, has never been to a MTB race and scheduled her wedding the same weekend so she didn't have to go. Glad it rained for her.

Hopefully the rumblings are correct and we will get a seperate series in the same vein as the FMB world series. If someone like say Martin Whitely was involved I have no doubt it would be a success and would work.

Freecaster (and the other media outlets) have shown the way forward and how to progress the sport, its a shame that the governing body only sees it as a cash cow.
banga
Member for: 14 years 7 months

Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby Wobbler on Mon 5/Sep/11 5:31pm

benw wrote:
Wobbler wrote:Given how shithouse the freecaster feed is sometimes I for one am glad for the bastard pirates

Any idea how hard it is to setup a free internet video streaming service to handle any number of concurrent feeds?

Still I guess you'd be happy with nothing, and nothing for the pirates to post either in that case...


No I dont, and I dont actually give a fuck how hard it is, I trust this helps you. I've paid for freecaster in the past and been annoyed (I'm so fucking sorry about that!) by missing a run due to a jerky feed. SO I'm glad when someone puts up a run that was otherwise missed.

ps I love freecaster, but you are a penis
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Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby cruiser on Mon 5/Sep/11 5:46pm

Banga, fully agree UCI are governing poorly, however the broadcast fees are hardly arbitrary numbers. The real issue is probably that Freecaster has no hope of making any profit because the industry as a whole is still of the minority - ala not supported by rich fat middle-aged men and their wives.

UCI being a bunch of people who agree with rich fat middle-aged man values doesn't help MTBing's cause either...but they are not entirely to blame. They are fundamentally driven by pressures to make money, as are most other organisations.

MTB as a sport will have its day with the rise of extreme sports and a new generation coming through. With it hopefully will be more chance of sponsorship bucks coming from global businesses such as what we see for other rich white man sports. It's too tough an industry to be funded by cycle-related businesses alone and for now the fatcat corporates are still attracted to rich fat white man sports like yachting, tennis and golf.

oh hang on, road cycling is the new golf...mtb is doomed.
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Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby banga on Mon 5/Sep/11 6:00pm

cruiser wrote:Banga, fully agree UCI are governing poorly, however the broadcast fees are hardly arbitrary numbers. The real issue is probably that Freecaster has no hope of making any profit because the industry as a whole is still of the minority - ala not supported by rich fat middle-aged men and their wives.

UCI being a bunch of people who agree with rich fat middle-aged man values doesn't help MTBing's cause either...but they are not entirely to blame. They are fundamentally driven by pressures to make money, as are most other organisations.

MTB as a sport will have its day with the rise of extreme sports and a new generation coming through. With it hopefully will be more chance of sponsorship bucks coming from global businesses such as what we see for other rich white man sports. It's too tough an industry to be funded by cycle-related businesses alone and for now the fatcat corporates are still attracted to rich fat white man sports like yachting, tennis and golf.

oh hang on, road cycling is the new golf...mtb is doomed.


From the UCI website
What is the UCI?
The UCI Statutes stipulate that:
1. The International Cycling Union (abbreviated as UCI) is the association of national cycling federations.
2. The UCI is an international, non profit-making and non-governmental association, officially recognised to be of international interest.
3. The headquarters of the UCI are in Switzerland (…).
http://www.uci.ch/templates/UCI/UCI1/la ... w&LangId=1


So much like FIFA (ha-ha), they shouldn't be milking the sport for cash to make a "profit", but they are.
It is an artbitrary fee, because it is just that-a fee. Not an act of covering costs. A fee for the privalege of streaming footage.

The amount of money I've spent over the years in race entries for nationals, national licences, international licences. I'd hate to think, and its all gone into the UCI black hole.

Gah, I'm done. I might pop a blood vessel soon.
banga
Member for: 14 years 7 months

Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby wuffy on Mon 5/Sep/11 6:10pm

I was possibly going to go over and film worlds for the NZ Team, but the sheer cost of what they're asking is ridiculous, not to mention the cost of getting over there and accommodation.

Dirt had a bit of trouble filming because they're not associated with a pre-certified team, Trek has the Parkins Bros, Commencal has Clay Porter, etc and all the big teams paid for filming rights, freecaster and their entry fees in their original payment to enter the WC at the start of the season. Dirt didn't as they didn't have a team to go with.
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Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby phantasim on Mon 5/Sep/11 6:21pm

wuffy wrote:I was possibly going to go over and film worlds for the NZ Team, but the sheer cost of what they're asking is ridiculous, not to mention the cost of getting over there and accommodation.

Dirt had a bit of trouble filming because they're not associated with a pre-certified team, Trek has the Parkins Bros, Commencal has Clay Porter, etc and all the big teams paid for filming rights, freecaster and their entry fees in their original payment to enter the WC at the start of the season. Dirt didn't as they didn't have a team to go with.


Was going to say they have the Dirt Norco team but I realised none of there riders were selected
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Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby cruiser on Mon 5/Sep/11 6:23pm

The guys filming have to get creative at generating revenue for their footage, that is all. easier said than done!

banga wrote:So much like FIFA (ha-ha), they shouldn't be milking the sport for cash to make a "profit", but they are.
It is an artbitrary fee, because it is just that-a fee. Not an act of covering costs. A fee for the privalege of streaming footage.

The amount of money I've spent over the years in race entries for nationals, national licences, international licences. I'd hate to think, and its all gone into the UCI black hole.

Gah, I'm done. I might pop a blood vessel soon.


yup. they're mostly driven by self-serving interests I'd say.

Cost-covering is not the corporate way. Demand drives prices, but sadly for Freecaster real demand = desire + ability and willingness to part with money. fair to say many would not willing to part with money, so really the main option is corporate sponsorships
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Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby onyabike on Mon 5/Sep/11 6:36pm

whew - glad that's all cleared up
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Re: 2011 Dh/4x World Cup Thread

Postby AJK on Mon 5/Sep/11 6:51pm

phantasim wrote:
wuffy wrote:I was possibly going to go over and film worlds for the NZ Team, but the sheer cost of what they're asking is ridiculous, not to mention the cost of getting over there and accommodation.

Dirt had a bit of trouble filming because they're not associated with a pre-certified team, Trek has the Parkins Bros, Commencal has Clay Porter, etc and all the big teams paid for filming rights, freecaster and their entry fees in their original payment to enter the WC at the start of the season. Dirt didn't as they didn't have a team to go with.


Was going to say they have the Dirt Norco team but I realised none of there riders were selected


Ben Reid?
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